THE WORD on The Word of Faith (a GroupBlog) » ex-word of faith testimony

Ex-Word of Faith Testimony of Mary

Damon Whitsell — Wed, 18 May 2011 22:04:40 +0000

Note from Admin: As usual I am very thankful for all the testimonies submitted here but especially this one because of the specific content it is very timely and I am sure it will be particularly helpful to someone the Lord sent to me a few months ago to try to help out of the WoF, which seems to be going very well after a real rough start. – The Lord Jesus Christ is so good. Please read the short and sweet testimony below and my further comments that follow. THANK YOU MARY!!!

I attended a WoF church since becoming a believer at age 33. Prior to this, my feelings about these kinds of churches was that they were all and out wierd. But, it was the church of our choosing because my neighbor went there and God had used her to get me into a good Bible study (not WoF). I instantly trusted and threw myself into every aspect of the church including completed the 2-year Bible school and our children attending the school associated with the church and a host of other activities. Many weeks I was at church 6 of 7 days. I knew that I had drifted far from my First Love and out of ignorance or pride I got more and more involved in the church instead of returning to the truth. You name it, I experienced it…the running the laughter, shaking, falling, strange prayer meetings, giving 18 percent of our annual income, speaking of the leader like he was a god.

About the year 2000, my husband began to search out other possible churches for us, but I was not in agreement. In 2003, he shared with me his realization that if we did not both leave the WoF church, our marriage would most likely crumble. These were the words that got me away from the church… and it would take me the next three years to deprogram. Today I can look back and be so grateful for those people in the crucial moments early on in my deprogramming who spoke the truth to me, those I reached out to whom had left the church. I see this time as the greatest miracle in my life since salvation. “The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse”, by Johnson & Vondervan and “Toxic Faith”, by Arterburn & Felton helped a great deal.

Now in 2011, I am grateful for it all having been rescued. I am stronger and in a way weaker too. I don’t ever want to think that I am beyond being deceived. I have a tenacity for the Word…not just the words, but God’s message in His Word. I want to be authentic and fruit bearing.

I still feel sadness when I think of the people that I hurt during this pride-filled time in my life..my family as they tried to reason with me about the leader of the church and how I lashed out at them in defense of him…and the woman who shared in our woman’s group that her husband had lost his job and that they had no money for groceries and how we “leaders” prayed for her to have more “faith” instead of giving to her what she needed and what we could have provided.

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Firstly, this testimony is particularly sweet to me because most of the people who have come to The Word of Faith Recovery Forums are looking for help and suggestions on how to help a spouse out of the WoF and how to cope with such stresses in the relationship that the Wof causes when either one spouse is in and the other not or if both spouses are in, it is always very stressful when one comes out (either in body or mind and soul) before the other. I am sad to report that I have met well over 100 Ex-Wofers and and have witnessed the WoF to be the ruin of too many marriages. Because of this I never suggest that a person give their spouse an ultimatum but I very much understand why some do, it is just that the WoF teachings are so divisive and stressful and relationships can be hard enough without all of that – I really like how mary’s hubby approached it, with love.

My advice is always the same, get equipped and love your spouses. By getting equipped I mean that if your spouse is in the WoF and you are not or you have already come out, you’ll need to know how to refute the devilish doctrines of the WoF – in other words, help them start the “deprogramming” process that is always involved in leaving the WoF. Look for doubts in the mind of your spouse about certain WoF teachings and learn all you can about that specific teaching, how it is twisted and taught and it’s biblical antithesis or truth. And of course it is always good to point out every chance you get that the WoF message sounds very good and alluring but it rarely delivers and when it does it is mostly coincidental, by chance and is usually the product of calling things miraculous that are far from miraculous (one instance comes to mind of a guy who called getting approved for a sub-prime loan on a motorcycle he thought he could not get a miracle not realizing this happens everyday to people of all walks everywhere, is all too common and with the extra interest it is not really even a blessing but a burden – if the Wof message was true why not just speak to your wallet or give to get until you can pay cash for everything your heart desires).

So I usually suggest getting prepared and pray pray pray and show love because it is the legendary love and goodness of the Lord that draws us to our God and more times than not it is love that draws people out of the WoF. But on the other hand if you have had all you can take, are prayed up, studied up and your at your last straw, I have seen ultimatums work but I suggest they not be given if they are not sincere. I AM SO HAPPY TO SEE MARY AND HER HUBBY STILL AS ONE FLESH!!! And I am always super grateful for those unique souls that quit believing in the WoF doctrine and wait patiently for the Lord to open their spouses eyes such as Conni Edwards did with her husband John Edwards (please see John’s, Connie’s and John’s brothers testimonies on our testimony page)

Secondly, you can use the search function in the side bar of this blog to find articles and videos for both of the outstanding books and authors Mary suggested, they really are great resources and you can also try the “Spiritual Abuse Recovery Sites” also listed in the side bar.

Thirdly, Gods strength is magnified in our weaknesses and His grace is sufficient for us in all things. Almost all WoFers have been taught to redefine salvation to always include health, wealth and material prosperity but in it’s basic sense salvation is a rescue and if we seek the Lord He will rescue us time and time again because He is just good like that and He will give us a hunger for relationship with Him and His word that will indeed produce authentic fruit bearing. I believe being WoF and being rescued from it uniquely enables and qualifies Ex’s to help others out of the WoF. That can be as simple as submitting a testimony to this site or a couple of others that collect such testimonies but also equips people with the love, empathy and knowledge it takes to help others. I would guess-timate that about close to 10-15 percent of the Ex-WoFers I have met go on to start blogs, start or get involved in support groups, write books and even get involved in documentary films about the WoF like co-founder of this groupblog Ex-WoF Pastor John Edwards did here. You can see John’s post on this blog here or visit his site at FaithPreacher.com.

Lastly, I believe feeling sad about those harmed is a common and appropriate feeling among Ex-WoFers. But all too often those sad feelings can be intermingled with guilty feelings and I don’t believe that is ever appropriate. When we are set free by the Lord we are free indeed and if we confess our sin He is faithful and just to cleanse us of all our unrighteousness and if we confess our sins one to another we will be healed. I believe it is important to remember that those things that may have caused others harm are learned behaviors that are inherent too and common in the WoF and that feelings of guilt are also prideful if we think the precious Blood of Jesus Christ cannot wash that stuff away and we cannot forgive ourselves for things the Lord forgives us for and does not even remember anymore. I can tell that the Lord has worked a genuine work in Mary’s heart because her last sentence captures the essence of the Gospel that most WoFers arrogantly miss but can be forgiven for.

NOTE TO MARY: Because I noticed you subscribed to this sites postings I would like to say that I did not mean to seem to preach at ya. I believe your testimony will be very pertinent to the person I mentioned in my preface that I felt I had to elaborate for her benefit and others that might read your testimony. I’ll leave comments open on this post if you would like to comment further or request anything I said to be changed. THANKS SO MUCH FOR CARING ENOUGH TO SHARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

VISIT OUR

(PDF AND AUDIO BOOK) 15 LIES OUR WORD OF FAITH MOVEMENT PASTORS TOLD US: Can ya FEEL the Spirit?

Damon Whitsell — Sun, 15 May 2011 08:56:05 +0000

ALL THESE PASTORS AND (and other WoF Pastors) ARE LIARS

Ernest Angley, John Bevere, Markus Bishop, Juanita Bynum, Morris Cerullo, Kim Clement, Kenneth Copeland, Paul Crouch, Creflo Dollar, Jesse Duplantis, Kenneth Hagin, Marilyn Hickey, Benny Hinn, Rodney Howard-Browne, Larry Huch, T.D. Jakes, Bishop Eddie L. Long, Clarence McClendon, Joyce Meyer, Myles Munroe, Steve Munsey, Mike Murdock, Joel Osteen, Rod Parsley, Peter Popoff, Fred Price, Oral Roberts, R.W. Shambach, Robert Schuller, Karl Strader, Robert Tilton, Paula White, Ed Young.

Hat Tip too Mike Rodgers at ClosingStages.net for showing me this site.

http://liesmypastortoldme.com
About the Book
Lies My Pastor Told Me was born out of Cole Brown’s experience as a newly converted Christian in his early twenties. Having no prior Christian background he ended up in what he assumed was a healthy church culture. Little did he know, the evangelical church culture his friends invited him into was feeding him clichés that were not only unbiblical, but damaging. Lies My Pastor Told Me confronts 15 of these common church clichés with the gospel and shows how they rob Jesus of the glory he deserves and rob his people of the true good he has for them.

About the Author
Cole Brown is lead pastor of Emmaus Church, an Acts 29 church plant in urban Portland, Oregon where he lives with his wife and two children. He has a Bachelor of Science in religion and psychology from Liberty University and is currently pursuing a Master of Arts in Biblical and Theological Studies at Western Seminary. When not writing he enjoys reading non-fiction, watching good film, and hearing good music of all genres. His first book, Lies My Pastor Told Me, was released as a free eBook in July of 2010.

01 Don’t Put Your Mouth On The Man Of God
02 The Bible Is God’s Rule Book
03 This Is God’s House
04 I Feel The Spirit
05 I Have Peace About This Decision
06 God Wants You To Be Rich
07 That Will Make You Sin
08 Speak It Into Existence
09 You’re Not Filled With The Holy Spirit If You Don’t Speak In Tongues
10 That’s The Devil
11 God Heals Those Who Have Faith
12 You Have A Generational Curse
13 She’s Not Anointed
14 Just Believe God
15 Doctrine Is Dangerous

CLICK HERE TO GO TO AUDIO DOWNLOAD PAGE
http://download1207.mediafire.com/zb1yyvlq7esg/y7kcoh335569tsh/LiesMyPastorToldMeAudio.zip

CLICK HERE TO GO TO BOOK PDF PAGE
http://download143.mediafire.com/i4oo1khggogg/k5gaqg0qeapk068/Lies+My+Pastor+Told+Me.pdf

OR GO HERE TO GET THE AUDIO AND BOOK PDF

http://liesmypastortoldme.com

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To see the damage these Pastors and their lies are responsible for

READ THESE TESTIMONIES

http://thewordonthewordoffaithinfoblog.com/testimony-page/

AND SEE THESE EX-WOFER SITES

TO SEE THE DEVASTATION THESE PASTORS AND THEIR LIES CAUSE SEE HERE. THEY EVEN KILL THOSE WHO LIE AND RE-DEFINE FAITH

http://www.letusreason.org/wf25.htm

http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/healthyself.html

DON’T LET THIS BE YOUR CHILD

11 year old girl accepts the dangerous doctrine that Christians should not go to Doctors

http://thewordonthewordoffaithinfoblog.com/2010/10/22/11-year-olds-accepts-the-dangerous-doctrine-that-christians-should-not-go-to-doctors/

RESOURCES FOR THE WOUNDED

RECOURCE VIDEOS AND ARTICLES: (Faith in Faith/Faith is a Force) What is Faith?

http://thewordonthewordoffaithinfoblog.com/2010/07/17/recource-videos-and-articles-faith-in-faithfaith-is-a-force-what-is-faith/

RESOURCE POST: Christian Suffering verses the Prosperity Gospel – Which one is Biblical?

http://thewordonthewordoffaithinfoblog.com/2011/04/20/resource-post-christian-suffering-verses-the-prosperity-gospel-which-one-is-biblical/

RESOURCE POST: Is the Word of Faith Movement a Cult?

http://thewordonthewordoffaithinfoblog.com/2011/04/07/resource-post-is-the-word-of-faith-movement-a-cult/

PLEASE PRAY FOR THE DEAD, THE DYING, THE WOUNDED

AND THOSE STILL LED ASTRAY

AND NEVER FORGET THEM

Ex-Word of Faith Testimony of Karen

Damon Whitsell — Mon, 28 Feb 2011 15:25:37 +0000

http://mkayla.wordpress.com/2011/02/27/as-he-wills-a-testimony/

This is a great testimony that a reader of http://mkayla.wordpress.com/ sent in as a comment.

I got saved in’ 78 on Valentines Day. What a love gift! But I immediately entered into the teachings of the Health and Wealth Gospel. After about 8 years of indoctrination and feeding on Kenyan, Hagin, Copeland, Capps, Hayes, Hickey, the Hunters, Savelle, Avanzene, Price and on and on to you know who -that would be Joyce of course- I had a good friend who had been just as steeped in the teaching who had moved away and who had begun to call me, dropping bombs in my spirit about it all being a lot of error. I would argue with her at first, but eventually the truth of it all began to chip away at what I had been taught.

Part of the chipping came while I was reading one of Watchman Nee’s books, “The Latent Power of the Soul. I remember reading “The Balanced Christian Life”, “The Spiritual Man”, “Sit, Walk, Stand”, “The Release of The Spirit”, “Christ:The Sum of All Things”, and” Spiritual Authority.” His books came highly recommended in Charismatic circles, but when I read “The Latent Power of The Soul” it did something to me. It startled me when Nee began to elaborate on the type of deceptive signs and wonders that would enter the Church in the last days. I, for one know I am saved; but unlike my Christian friends at the time, I always felt that I could be deceived if I was not careful. Like me they did not believe in “once saved, always saved,” but when I shared the thought that the deception coming would be so intense that if possible even we could be deceived with another of my best Christian friends at the time, she assured me I had nothing to worry about, that the Lord would never let me be so deceived. How could she be so sure? And she was positive! Even though I could not at the time explain it, something seemed suddenly very wrong. Shocked that she would think that way, I began to pull away from everyone and reevaluate what I was learning in the faith and wealth gospel. I remember deciding not to call any of my friends and just read and seek God about it all.

As I did, I was blown away that in James we are taught that it is the poor (and the context is not talking about “poor in spirit” but is obviously talking about poor with little finances) who are rich in faith. Certainly not the message of the Copelands! I also remember we were taught not to say “if it be they will” because that showed doubt and doubt and unbelief would hinder your prayers. We were taught to learn through the Word what the Will of God was and not pray “if it be thy will.”

Then I read in James 4, thank God, “13Now listen, you who say, “Today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city, spend a year there, carry on business and make money.” 14Why, you do not even know what will happen tomorrow. What is your life? You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes. 15Instead, you ought to say, “If it is the Lord’s will, we will live and do this or that.” 16As it is, you boast and brag. All such boasting is evil. 17Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn’t do it, sins.”

Oh, my. What we were being taught was boasting and evil. I was flabbergasted. How in the world could we possibly know the Lord’s will 100% of the time. How arrogant! Then I remember being taught that we really did not want to be like Job, because Job had a lot of fear and doubt and because of that, what he feared came upon Him. We were led away from considering Job and his sufferings. It was a place we did not want to go. We were to be stronger and more steadfast in our faith than he was and so it was not a book we loved or studied.

Finally, I got real sick. I had been a Flight Attendant for 24 years when after years of lifting and such, over a period of a year, my back began to hurt to the point that finally I just had to give in and go out on LTD. With extra time on my hands, I flew to have Ernest Anley pray for me, as well as other “men of faith.” Believeing we were to “call those things that be not as though they were”, I also made a tape of healing scriptures and left a blank spot after each scripture so that’ as I listened to it I could “say it out loud” before the next scripture, in order to get them down in my spirit and to build myself up in my faith that I was healed etc. Daily, I would play the tape and confess the healing scriptures. I did everything I had been taught to do and more, but no dice! I could not get the Lord to heal me. Finally, while I was in bed for a month at the orders of my neursurgeon, I broke down, desperate for answers and in lots of pain, and opened my Bible to Job. As I read it, tears flowed and I could not believe how wonderful it was.

God’s wisdom far exceeded mine and always would. After all where was I when He decided where He would store the hail? Wow, He stores the hail somewhere. And where was I when He told the waves “this far and no more!” Who in the world did I think I was to be able to know His will and never have a doubt about it. But my freedom came when I heard Job say, “though you slay me I will serve you.” I had so much pain, I did not know how I could endure it for long, even though I knew there were others who lived with even more pain than I. But when I read that, I began to cry and asked the Lord to forgive me and told Him that “even though it felt like I was dying, it did not matter when or how or even if I never got healed and that Satan would not win, that I would serve The lord all the days of my life, no matter what happened! Then and only then could I relax and as I did over the next months, I got better and better.

Today, I am not totally healed, but that does not matter. I am able to function and I am productive and I minister to others and I am happy and I even thank Him today for my healing me. And on top of that, I believe a good part of getting better came when I did what God told Job to do. He told him to pray for his friends (many of his accusers) and when he did the tables changed for Job and the Lord says He “turned the captivity of Job when he prayed for his friends.” Then (secondarily) He says He then gave Job twice as much as he had before. What a pity that people are led away from this book for fear it will undermine their faith.

But back to the reason for my writing you. Back to that tiny little book, “The Latent Power of the Soul.” Interesting that someone who grew up in China and who most likely had seen many,many false miracles that originated in the soul of man (I think of the religions of India where so much soul power is used), would see ahead to the last days that we live in and be able to articulate the false signs and wonders that are in the Church right now while so many Christians are clueless that they are false. I just wonder how many Charismatics have read this book and have just skipped over the pages or torn them out so to speak, as they accuse the Baptist of doing when it comes to the scriptures on tongues. He describes the laughing revival and how false it is. He describes many things that will blow to smithereens the Modern day Faith Movement. But why can they not see it? I can only conclude that the teaching causes such arrogance that they truly think they cannot be deceived and so are just that=very deceived. And do not, do not, do not want to hear otherwise!

I do want to clarify that I do not agree with everything that Watchman Nee teaches in his books. My point is mainly that many Charismatic like his teachings and yet they do not hear what he said years ago about the end times concerning things like laughing uncontrollably on queue and singing lines of songs over and over and over until you are in an altered state, and preachers repeating sermons in a heightened emotional state with the assurance it will bring about certain reactions, etc.

My point is that some of what he teaches is accurate concerning the types of false signs and wonders of in the Church today, yet those that like His teachings ignore what he has to say about them in his book. There is enough truth in the “The Latent Power of the Soul” concerning signs and wonders in the last days that it should alarm the reader to the point that they would pray that the Lord keep them from falling for them. However, I do not believe many of his readers even think they could be the one’s to be deceived.

One day, the Lord will tell us exactly how all the false signs and wonders are performed and how to more accurately detect them. Until then, he has given us enough information to discern them. Surely, it is not exactly as Watchman Nee has said. However, it is certain that the power that God talks about is an abomination and that we need to shun this power that has to do with the mind, the soul, our emotions and demon spirits. I do not see a totally valid basis for Nee’s saying Adam had tremendous Soul power before the fall, but it does seem to be evident that there is some kind of power that is easily triggered through our minds with the help of demon spirits and that the Church will fall for it and operate in a lot of it in the end times.

Any way you look at it, many today are more interested in feeling something than trusting that God is with us. As I write, I remember as a child I did believe what I was taught in Catechism about the Holy Spirit. As a little girl we were expected to memorize and quote big words like the The Holy Spirit is “omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent.” Omnipresent means He is present with me. Once we are saved, and we know He now lives in us, why is that so hard for us to understand.

Why do we have to feel something to believe that He is with us? Why can’t we believe we can be healed without lying down on the floor with our pillows, while the lights are out and beautiful music is playing, while a facilitator is hovering over us or stroking us to comfort us that Jesus is here and Jesus wants to speak to us and Jesus wants to heal us? Why do we need to break out in laughter to be assured that we really have Joy. I am sort of offended at that premise. If the joy of the Lord is my strength, it is sad to think that I would have to break out in laughter to have that joy. It is sad that I have to go to those lengths to be strengthened. It is a shame that I cannot have it quietly, individually, moment by moment , as I meditate on His Word or I think about the wonderful things He has done for me and others. Laughter is a good medicine! But it is not the only way for me to have joy! And to be honest, I think that joy goes much deeper than laughter. Deep calls unto deep! My strength is anchored in something much deeper than laughter. My joy is anchored in something much deeper than laughter.

Now that I am saved, the deepest place in me cries out to the deepest place in God for what I lack,for what I need, for what I want to understand and when they touch, “my deep and His deep,” I experience in my spirit the Giver of Life, the Healer, the Comforter, the Lover of My Soul. And alone in those moments I am strengthened and I receive the answers or revelations that “He decides” to give, “as He will”. We need facilitators to bring me to this place? I believe if we truly love God and are seeking Him we will come to this on our own by His Spirit. Do we really need facilitators to bring us to this place or are they operating in a different spirit to make it happen. I believe whenever the Holy Spirit does something, it is wrong for us to try to duplicate it. It no longer is “as He wills”, but rather we have introduced something else into the equation to reproduce the experience and it becomes mixed. If it is mixed it is no longer purely the Holy Spirit’s doing but rather it is now the flesh, the soul, a work of man rather than God. A false sign. A false method. And if we continue to move in that method we get farther and farther away from the Spirit of God, while the devil cloaks the method in deception and feelings and emotions and the ignorant believe it is truly the Holy Spirit while the facilitators revel in the results. And the truth is the results are not what the Lord willed, but rather a result of a fleshly method and manipulation.

Gee, I know the Political Liberal’s new name for themselves is Progressives and apparently they cringe at the older folks who stand in the way of their new progressive thought. I suspect these facilitators, like the soaking and contemplative ones, must be the new Christian Progressives who cringe at people like me who won’t buy into their new thought. I believe in signs and wonders, but as the Lord wills! The truth is they are false teachers tickling the ears of many who HEAP them to themselves!

My sister is a New Ager. She is an Ordained Minister in the New Age. She started out going up to the Edgar Casey Foundation For over 30 years ago and that led to getting involved with EST training, teaching a “Course In Miracles,”, walking on coals, reading Tara Cards, charting Astrology Charts for engaged couples and on and on it goes. I have known in my heart that the New Age would be at the heart of the Great Falling Away. I talked to my sister tonight. And just like those in the Faith Movement and all that it has evolved into today, she is as hard a case to crack. It is apparent to me that they all could fall for the same false signs and wonders in the end. Who would have thought.

We cannot say we have not been warned.

Karen

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UPDATE: In an email exchange with me, Karen wrote the following and gave me permission to add it to this testimony post. I am also adding a portion of my response to her.

Hi, Damon, I want to thank you for posting my comment (large comment- LOL) on your web. I really hope it will help someone come out of the heresy of the WOF movement. I remember towards the end it was real apparent to me that those who did not, could not, for what ever reason, ”get their healing” that we secretely or silently thought of them as second class faith men or women. Those that could not jump on board the healing train and receive their healing were sort of left behind and overlooked in the long run. They were given a chance at first when they would go up for prayer, but if a few months went by and they still had not received their healing, they were thought to have little faith and they were “Left Behind’ by those of us who were “strong in faith! I shared this with a Pastor years later who had also come out of the movement. He told me what did it for him was the day he went to pray for a man in the hospital. He told me he went and prayed for the man,and as He left, the Holy Spirit said to him, in what he knew to be a very sarcastic tone, “Some Prayer! Wow, that was powerful.” Immediately he was pierced through and through, knowing the Holy Spirit was grieved that he had no intentions of spending time visiting with the man, but went just to pray a “powerful prayer”. Something really sick had happened to us in this movement. We thought we were sooo compassionate praying our loud and bold and power-packed prayers, stuffed with perfectly memorized scriptures; really we had no desire or patience to stay and visit with these hurting people! We prayed and ran and felt we had done our duty! Surely this was not what Jesus had in mind when he said ”when I was sick you visited me! ” We made our rounds so to speak and left them in the dust, still lonely and scared and hurting. We were too busy or important to tarry with them and visit a while, to comfort them in their distress. Yes,he wants to heal us, but how can we just pray and run and say that is love?

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I want to tell you that your email here is very unique,, I studied and posted on the WoF for 2 1/2 years and have received allot of testimonies and your email here is the only one to acknowledge the pain it caused other people. Most people talk about how much it hurt them and their loved ones, and I have heard so many tragic stories, but your comment here is very refreshing. Not that I doubt the Lord can do it, and I am sure he has in many cases, but it is good to see He is working on someones heart and showing them the pain the false teaching must have caused others.

VISIT OUR

Ex-Word of Faith Testimony: Leaving the “River” of Charismatic/WoF Cultism by Kevin Reeves

Damon Whitsell — Wed, 22 Sep 2010 18:17:01 +0000

Some friends of mines journey out of the charismatic and WoF movements began with reading a book called “The Other Side of the River“. Here is a brief description of the book.

There is a major doctrinal movement sweeping through the Church. Billing itself as the “River,” it promises an incoming tide of blessing but leaves in its wake tsunami-like devastation. Marked by false prophecies, unbiblical manifestations and cult-like teachings and authority structure, this latest Christian fad has wooed a generation of unwary believers and led them into a substitute spirituality.

While the Word of God has been placed on the back burner, personal experience reigns supreme amid a host of unscriptural visions and ecstatic utterances that have paved the way for a radical departure from the apostolic Christianity of the early Church. In this deeply personal account, Kevin Reeves explores the inner workings of this worldwide phenomenon.

After my friends mentioned this book at least 7 or 8 times I decided to google the book and read the reviews of it online. And when I did I found the books website which contains some really good articles. This one is a testimony by the author of the book Kevin Reeves. I have not read the book but I assume that most all of this is covered in its pages, which my friends told me was an account of the author leaving the WoF and other heretical and cultic teachings in the Charismatic movement. I pray you will enjoy and will be blessed by reading this sizable and detailed testimony containing a descent amount of quality refutation of some of these teachings intertwined with the authors experiences and good advice.

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CHARISMATIC CULTISM by Kevin Reeves

“What agreement has the temple of God with idols?” (2 Corinthians 6:16)

About a year ago a friend of mine attended a Sunday morning church service in a Charismatic group noted for its exuberant worship, local involvement, and passionate children’s ministry. The pastor was a relatively new to the area, middle-age veteran whose outgoing personality and dynamic approach to ministry offered hope to the town’s spiritually lagging church system. During this one particular service, the pastor read the Acts 5 account of Ananias and Sapphira. Pausing, he looked out across the congregation and, according to my friend solemnly warned, “Don’t speak against what goes on in this church. If you do—you just be careful.”

The implication to my horrified friend was crystal clear. What went on in those services was of God. Coming against or questioning any incidents or manifestations was tantamount to provoking God. And God would deal with the malcontent as He had Ananias and Sapphira.

My friend, who is a solid believer in Christ, understandably left that church and has never returned.

I believe this minister’s heart is sincere, that he desires the best for his people, and that he is a true Christian. But his promotion of Benny Hinn, TBN, and his involvement with the current “River” movement via the Brownsville Revival have left the door wide open to the same kind of control and manipulation that have become a hallmark of the aforementioned “ministries”. Benny Hinn’s now-famous Denver crusade anathema against detractors, Vineyard and Toronto preachers’ invective toward “accusers of the brethren” and “pharisees”, pastor John Kilpatrick’s 1997 “prophecy” of destruction directed at Bible apologist Hank Hannegraaf, and the multi-faceted threats and insults leveled by “River” pastors at genuine, seeking believers amply demonstrate the dictator mentality that has come to pervade their ranks.

Discerning believers are rightly alarmed by the many dramatic departures from orthodox Christianity, heretical doctrines that have come from within the Church itself. And far too often, efforts on the part of these concerned Christians have been met with stonewalling, resistance, or outright condemnation from the shepherds that are supposed to be guarding the flock.

Despite my own horrendous exposure to false doctrine and the subsequent uphill battle I fought to correct it, I am still a Pentecostal Christian who believes in the validity of the gifts of the Spirit are for today. It was with tremendous heartache that I felt the need to exit a congregation “moved by every wind of doctrine”, and this only after more than a year of concerted action to address issues that I had finally realized were contrary to the Gospel itself. My twelve year attendance and six year standing as elder did nothing to effect change. On the contrary, my credibility suffered irreparable damage within my own congregation, I became the butt of insinuation and behind-the-scenes labeling, and my many concerns were eventually dismissed from the public arena. While I desired wholesale repentance, I was basically assured none was needed. Only after a year of pleading on my part was it even agreed to discuss these issues in an eldership forum, and then only two meetings were permitted before it was unceremoniously shut down. After the first meeting’s video presentation that I gave of Toronto-style animal manifestations, spiritual drunkenness (which included men falling on top of women and all manner of carnal indecency), and a host of bizarre, unbiblical manifestations attributed to the “anointing”, it was basically decided (by everyone but my wife and I) that, because all of us had experienced some of the same manifestations at one time or another, it must have been from God. In fact, one of the leadership present even suggested that, although the video itself “made my skin crawl”, he could see that animal manifestations done “decently and in order” could conceivably be from God.

That begs the question, “How does a Christian get down on all fours and bark decently and in order?”

The most resistance I met during the entire year and at both eldership meetings had to do with naming names. Many of the superstars of Charismatic Christianity—all of which had been actively promoted by our church group—were the same ones guilty of the most flagrant and heretical doctrines. Despite the voluminous documentation which I continuously presented over the entire twelve months, the thought of going public against the teachings of “the Lord’s anointed” caused every member of the leadership, with the exception of my wife and myself, to recoil in fear. We cannot touch God’s appointed servants, we were told. God would eventually deal with them Himself. We were cautioned not to use pulpit time to expose their teachings as heresy, despite the obvious havoc it wreaked among the believing community. Just teach truth, the rest of the leadership insisted, and the error will be corrected.

Let’s be clear about this. When members of the Word of Faith camp (Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Joyce Meyers, et al) teach that the cross of Jesus Christ did not atone for sins, but rather Christ’s taking the punishment in hell as a mere man in our place (Jesus died spiritually), then that is heresy. When Copeland claims God told him Jesus became born again in hell, that is heresy. When Hagin claims that the believer is as much an incarnation as the Son of God, that is heresy. When Benny Hinn told his nationwide television audience that Jesus Christ was going to appear physically with him on stage at one of his crusades, then that is heresy.

You get the idea.

What we’re dealing with here are not peripheral issues. These doctrines are crucial to our salvation. Anyone who presents to the Church any doctrine that alters the character, nature, or being of God or of Christ’s salvation falls under the curse of Galatians 1:8-9. Word of Faith and “River” revival teachers have done that—repeatedly and without apology. But because of their status as teachers of the Word of God, they have been granted virtual immunity. To critically examine the doctrines they promote and speak out against discovered aberrance or heresy is to invite the certain judgment of God, it is stated. After all, the reasoning goes, God put them in the pulpit in the first place, His anointing is on them, and we are not to touch the Lord’s anointed. God will deal with them in His own time and in His own way.

We have become like the Israelites at the foot of Mount Sinai—partying away before a golden calf while Moses stands seething on the cliff with the commandments of God in his hand.

While we are told repeatedly not to speak against leaders, the main problem with that mind set is that God has always used men to correct men, especially within His own Church. Paul stood up against the hypocrisy of Peter (Galatians 2:11-14), John exposed Diotrophes (3 John 9-10), Paul delivered Hymaneus and Alexander over to Satan because of their blasphemy (1 Timothy 1:20). The Bible is replete with examples of godly confrontation with false doctrine, and commendation for an unwavering stand on the truth.

Why has this situation been allowed to proliferate for so long? I believe one of the main causes is due to a cancer that has wrapped around the hearts of sincere believers. Cultism is no longer an issue just for Mormons, the Unification Church, and Jehovah’s Witnesses. It has entered the Church—big time.

Open My Eyes, Lord

Becoming suspicious of certain doctrines in my former congregation that I discovered had a flimsy or nonexistent Scriptural basis, I began in 1999 an in-depth research that surprisingly led in the direction of established cults. Having for the previous thirteen years been involved in ministering to various cult groups that would show up on my doorstep, I became very curious as to parallels within the Charismatic mainstream. Concentrating one particular evening on matching up common characteristics, I became thoroughly frightened. I discovered that of about ten major defining marks of cults, my former congregation bore witness in varying degrees to most of them. Further study only confirmed my initial findings.

Since that time, I have come across these same characteristics in other Christian groups and their leadership in alarming number. The “River” movement (including both the Toronto Blessing, the Brownsville Revival, and church congregations that follow their teachings), Word of Faith, Dominion/Kingdom Now/Latter Rain, and any number of independent congregations on the fringe of these movements all bear, to some degree, the earmarks of cultish systems.

The first thing they all have in common is extrabiblical revelation. Simply put, this is any revelation that cannot be justified by the clear Word of God. We must be precise on this. The Bible is not some veiled mystery to the uninitiated that mandates taking believers through gradual steps of esoteric wisdom. Simply put, the Bible is easily understood by those who are born again, because they have the Spirit of God living within them to illuminate what is already written.

“And as for you, the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him” (1 John 2:27).

True believers in Christ Jesus do not need additional wisdom found outside the safe perimeters of the already revealed Word of God.

“All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work” (2 Timothy 3:16-17). With the Spirit of God to guide us, nothing is lacking in holiness or power.

Perhaps today more than ever, self-acclaimed teachers are coming into the spotlight and declaring things that Christ never said, or that have no reference point in the Scriptures. The apostle Paul said in 1 Corinthians 4:6 that we are “not to exceed what is written, in order that no one of you might become arrogant in behalf of one against the other.” When prophet Bob Jones declared that his hands turn purple at the approach of witchcraft, or golden due to intercession going up before the throne of God, then he has no reference point in the Bible. We are faced with the simple decision to either believe him or not. Without verification from God’s own Word, to take Jones’ claims at face value amounts to willing self-deception.

When I presented Jones’ testimony of his color-changing hands to my pastor, I received a smile, a shrug of the shoulders, and, a blithe “Well, not everything is in the Bible.” Jones had years earlier prophesied over my pastor and his wife, and impressed them. They were not prepared to go counter to the man, no matter how many times he claimed to have face-to-face visits with Jesus Christ or how contrary to the Scriptures his “revelation knowledge.”

I ran head-on into this same wall times without number. John 21:25 has been cited as proof that we can scoot along on manifestations missing from the Scriptures. While it is true that not everything Jesus did is recorded in the Word, what is recorded does not in any way match Jones’ experiences. If the Son of God didn’t manifest these spiritual phenomena, then we proceed with them at our own risk.

Every cult in the world has its origins in extrabiblical doctrine. I would submit that there is no difference between Joseph Smith’s claim of an angel’s guidance in revealing the supposed “golden plates” that revealed Anew” truth, and Rick Joyner’s claim in “The Final Quest” that a spirit of a deceased Christian revealed confession of sin is sometimes necessary after death. Neither doctrine can be found in the Bible.

I Have A Testimony!

Which naturally leads to the second common trait—preference of experience over the sure counsel of God’s Word. I can’t tell you how many times believers have told me basically, “Look, I can’t receive what you are saying about deception in the Church. I had a vision (or dream, or shaking, or drunk in the spirit, or whatever), and I know that it was from God.”

This same attitude was prevalent in the two eldership meetings I went to that had been granted to discuss these issues. I have even been told by a member of leadership, in the presence of a former pastor of this congregation, that, “Sometimes our experiences are so powerful, that we need to just set the Scriptures aside and go with the experience, and wait for the time for God to show us the experience in the Word.”

I was literally speechless and my pastor, by his silence and consistent conduct, proved in agreement with that philosophy.

Set the Word of God aside? Did this kind of thinking ever enter into Christ’s mind or teaching? Repeatedly He cited the Scriptures to expose the fraudulent, and to validate His own ministry. Speaking to the Pharisees He said, “You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life, and it is these that bear witness of Me” (John 5:39). When He faced Satan in the wilderness, the weapon He wielded was the Word of God, and it was sufficient to frustrate the most powerful demon in existence. Set the Word aside? Would we disarm ourselves and stand with arms spread waiting to embrace the first spiritual experience that comes along?

Often I’ve spoken with Mormons, who have told me, “It doesn’t matter what the Scriptures say. I’ve got the ‘burning in the bosom’ and I just know the Book of Mormon is of God.”

Enough said.

All Together, Now

This mind set leads to yet another established trait of cultic groups—syncretism, meaning the combination of all forms of spiritual thought assisting the devotee on his quest for enlightenment. These are hard words, for it makes some Christian congregations sound like members of a Hindu sect. But if we are honest, we must admit that the tendency for many believers these days is toward spiritual smorgasbord. A little of this, a little of that. When John Wimber officially introduced inner healing and wild manifestations blamed on the Holy Spirit, he was generally welcomed with open arms, even among some evangelical churches. And this despite his crediting such people as Morton Kelsey (who called Jesus a shaman who passed on psychic powers to His disciples) with offering Wimber wisdom in developing his spiritual approach. New Age thought had finally gained acceptance in the Church. When I presented a case to both my pastor and his wife of the “born-again Jesus” heresy preached by Kenneth Copeland, the consensus was, “Well, I know he (Copeland) teaches some stuff that’s a bit ‘off’, but he teaches some good stuff too. And that is what we take from him. Only the good stuff.”

Using this brand of reasoning, even the devil had some good stuff to say. Remember in Matthew 4:6, when tempting Jesus to throw Himself from the Temple pinnacle, Satan backed up His temptation with a quote from Psalm 91—”He will give His angels charge concerning you, and on their hands they will bear You up.”

Let’s not stop there. Every Mormon that ever entered my home to preach their false gospel believed in salvation through faith in Jesus. When I said Christ, they did too, when I spoke of the Father, they smiled and nodded. The problem was, their “Jesus” didn’t match the Scriptural record, and their “father” and “holy spirit”, although presented with a facade of truth, proved to be completely contrary to Biblical revelation. Certainly Mormons preach a gospel, but it has just enough of a veneer of the genuine to trap the undiscerning seeker. Do we then glean what’s “good” from Mormon doctrine and leave the rest, as many Charismatic believers are wont to do with their preferred superstar teachers?

May it never be! God hates mixture. Light cannot cohabit with darkness. Truth cannot share the platform with the false, nor the Spirit of God with antichrist. Have we attained such sophistication that we sigh and smilingly shake our heads at blatant heresy, yet continue to feed from the trough sprinkled with a few kernels of real grain amid rotting piles of garbage?

Speaking to the Corinthian congregation about idols (a false representation of God), the apostle Paul commanded, “You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the table of demons” (1 Corinthians 10:21).

Make no mistake—seducing spirits have peppered the doctrine of Christ with doctrines of demons, and are leading many in the Church astray (1 Timothy 4:1). And because we are warned by our shepherds not to question, the very place discernment should be practiced—the congregation of believers—has become a shelter to false teachers.

Money, Money, Who’s Got The Money?

Financial manipulation is also a big thing among the cults—and the Charismatic church. What televangelist superstar does not place heavy emphasis on money, especially contributions to his/her own ministry? I’ve never seen a one of them take the platform wearing what I normally wear. Expensive rings, gold jewelry, Rolex watches, $500 suits grace their forms as they preach the Word of God, all the time crying insufficient funds to make the next crusade. Benny Hinn hit a new low during his latest Australian escapade, promising name plaques for donors, ranging from $150,000, which will get your name placed on building stones at the “People’s Cathedral, down to a paltry $150 to get a mention on a guernsey at the prayer tower, according to an Australian newspaper article. Hinn has consistently made money a top-of-the-list priority for his multi-million dollar ministry. He has repeatedly proven he will not attempt to live on the salary of the average behind-the-scenes pastor. Even the latest update that I know of has John Kilpatrick of Brownsville fame living on a sparse $100,000 yearly income.

This fixation of money is a hallmark of such groups as Mormons (whose forced tithes and business enterprises reap worldwide financial gain), the “Moonies” (whose leadership has lived in overwhelming luxury purchased by the sweat of its on-the-street adherents), and the Jehovah’s Witnesses (whose Watchtower Bible and Tract Society has raked in untold millions due to the efforts of its overburdened converts). Word of Faith ministers, who, according to pastor David Wilkerson of Times Square Church, have on video told their followers to take the widow’s last five dollars so she can have a “seed faith” reward, have by their greed earned a position right alongside all of the cult leaders mentioned above. No wonder the world laughs at Christianity.

“And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth is maligned; and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep” (2 Peter 2:2-3).

Though it was generally used with good intentions tithing, the main source of church income, was a prerequisite for good standing in my former congregation. As an elder and along with my superiors, I often critically judged as spiritually immature those who would not give at least a tenth of their income. Now, having researched tithing according to what the Bible alone has to say about it, I’ve come to the conclusion that it is no longer in effect. That is another issue altogether. Suffice it to say that New Testament believers were urged by Paul to “Let each one of you do just as he has purposed in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver” (2 Corinthians 9:7). Tithing was definitely under compulsion—it was written in the Law that whoever did not give the full tithe was under the curse (Malachi 3:8-11). But Galatians 3:13 states that Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the Law. Stepping back to Galatians 3:10 we see that all the works of the Law are under the curse, and to attempt to perform one part of the Law (tithe) but neglect the others puts the person under that same curse. But Christ has fulfilled the Law in us (Romans 8:3-4). While we are to give generously, it is only in accordance with what we ourselves purpose in our own hearts. Any manipulation by outside forces (even the local congregation) is flat out un-Scriptural.

Remember, the whole point of Paul’s letter to the Galatians was to turn back a congregation that had fallen prey to Judaizers who were trying to bring this group of Christians back under the Old Testament Law. Paul said of such men, “Let them be accursed!” (Galatians 1:6-9). While the average Charismatic congregation holds no Judaizers (my former group included), this mix of Old and New Testament doctrine causes guilt and confusion. We are under one or the other. As simple as that.

And tithe money is often used to purchase teaching materials, books and videos featuring the very same teachers that propagate false doctrine. It happened al the time in my former congregation.

Silenced By Fear

Another major trait held in common between Charismatic Christian groups and cults is fear. In fact, it is probably a pretty decisive personal factor in determining the validity of the people one is involved with. For many years I heard and read things—about the Toronto Blessing, leaders in the prophetic movement, even within my own group—that I wondered about but was too afraid to persistently question. Things like Christians in animal manifestation, supposed prophetic words, even, at one point, witnessing a worship leader lying on the floor of the sanctuary in the throes of what looked for all the world like sexual passion. Each time I dared to mention some hesitation to accept these at face value, I was assured that these men and women were acting and speaking “under the anointing”. When something became too glaring to overlook and I felt it my duty to speak out more boldly, I was dismissed with the admonition that I should read a specific book (authored by someone supporting the very person or practice I questioned), and I was made to feel spiritually immature. Once in a great while I actually got into a shouting match with my ex-pastor over certain issues, often involving his controlling spirit. He always seemed to win, for I cannot pinpoint any positive change after the debate.

When I began my private research I was terrified I was going against God by questioning what my own leadership and the front-running ministers in the Charismatic arena were telling us. I kept praying, “Lord, please don’t hold this against me. I don’t want to blaspheme the Holy Spirit. I’m just trying to find out the truth.”

A great deal of prayer, Bible study, and reading about cult beliefs confirmed what my years in dealing with these same kinds of people should have told me. Fear is one of the biggest factors, not only in keeping the average congregant in line, but keeping him from exiting the controlling group. We were always told, “Bloom where you’re planted”, and entertaining thoughts of departure was tantamount to leaving the blessings of God. “Covering” was so important, and as we were supposed to be the cutting-edge church group in town, stepping out from under the “covering” of our anointed fellowship could only mean we were going down a notch spiritually. As an elder I would occasionally lament over a brother or sister who left our ranks, believing they would be the worse for it.

And make no mistake. It is common in the extreme for groups like Brownsville and Toronto to threaten those who seek a Scriptural answer for the goings-on in those places. The “River” movement, supposedly based on both the power and the love of the Spirit of God, is notorious for raking over the coals the disagreeing believer. “Pharisees”, “hypocrites”, “blasphemers” are just a sampling of the vocabulary that comes forth from these “anointed” ministers. The gentleness and reasonableness of the Holy Spirit (James 3:17-18) is glaringly absent. From the very pulpits that minimize or deride the Word of God (anybody remember John Scotland’s insulting drunken performance at Toronto in 1997), come a barrage of insults and threats of divine judgment toward those who try to honor that same canon of Scripture. I’ve seen it firsthand, and have suffered some behind-the-back labeling myself.

Who Is At The Helm?

Which brings up yet another common thread between many Charismatic and cult groups—control. When people did not receive Jesus, He told them the truth and simply walked away. He did not manipulate anyone into following Him. It was a freewill act or nothing. The “River” movement, with all its attendant “streams” of gold dust, angel feathers, bizarre visions and prophetic words, and animal manifestations has promoted itself as the church on the “cutting edge” of what God is doing today. When you think you’re at the top of the heap, hardening of the heart is just the natural result. Every cult member believes his team’s truth is the final word, and will defend, often to the death, the basic tenets of his group regardless of the amount of evidence to the contrary. And, once you’ve got that mind set, you’re trapped, but good. Let’s face it—if you’ve come to the highest pinnacle of revelation, where can you go from there but down? Anyone leaving the group is subject to scare tactics to force him to return, pity when realizing he won’t, and often shunning when he walks away for good or goes public with what he knows. Control is key in maintaining the appearance of unity. When your people start leaving it looks like the pastor is too poor a shepherd care for his flock.

Can I say that, Biblically, the only “covering” we have is the Lord Jesus Christ. A group of four meeting in a private home (as my wife and I do with two others who have left the same congregation) is as much a part of the Church as a mega-group with branches worldwide. To be honest, it’s a vast relief not to be “cutting-edge”, and trying to keep up with all the latest deviations from Scripture. What a joy it is to just believe the pure Word of God and worship humbly, knowing that the reservoir of truth resides not in you but in Christ (Colossians 2:3). If fear of God’s punishment is a determining factor in maintaining one’s adherence to a group, it is a dead giveaway that, at the very least, its leadership are not acting in a godly manner and should be avoided.

A defective view of Christ, the Father, or the Holy Spirit indicates cult-like tendencies. To the Jehovah’s Witnesses, Jesus is the archangel Michael, to the Baha’i’s He is only one of a whole string of messiahs, to the Mormons, He is the spirit brother of Lucifer. To Word of Faith—well, perhaps we can see the cultic ties more clearly in their view of Christ than in any other field. Kenneth Copeland, Kenneth Hagin and a host of Word of Faith leadership teach that the atonement did not take place on the cross, but in hell. Simply put, it was not the blood of Christ that spoke for the full and complete atonement of man to God. Hagin has said that if a physical death was all it took to pay the price, the thief on the cross could have done that. No, Word of Faith teaches that Christ went to hell (as a mere man) in our place, suffered torment for three at the hands of demon spirits who rejoiced over their victory, and then became born again. You heard right. Jesus Christ, the Son of God who is the great I Am (John 8:58), the eternal God (Isaiah 6:1-4) who is the same yesterday, today and forever (Hebrews 13:8)…had to be born again.

If it weren’t for the shipwreck of faith that is the result of this heresy, it would be nearly laughable. Taken point by point, even the most basic of Bible students can unravel the faulty reasoning. Christ did not divest Himself of His deity when coming to earth as a man. He merely took on an additional nature without detracting from the first. He could not separate Himself from the essence of who He was—God. To do so would have made Him not God in the first place. And since Hebrews 13:8 assures us that Christ does not change, nor has ever changed, then we can be certain that, contrary to Rodney Howard-Browne’s assertion that Christ walked the earth only as a man under the Abrahamic covenant, that in fact Jesus Christ always was, is and shall ever be the unchanging God of all flesh.

Word of Faith’s doctrine of Christ’s taking the punishment for humanity’s sins in hell also strikes at the very heart of the Gospel salvation. It is the cross that has been the focal point of orthodox Christianity for the past two millennia. Everything that needed to be done in regard to man’s reconciliation to a holy God was accomplished on the cross. When Jesus turned to the repentant thief beside Him, He said, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise” (Luke 23:43). Unless the definition of “Paradise” has changed over the course of two thousand years, we can safely assume that is exactly where Christ went. According to Hagin’s and Copeland’s theology, Jesus went to hell and took the thief with Him, to suffer demon torment while He waited to be “born again”. It should be noted too that when Christ cried out, “It is finished!”, the meaning of the Greek word there is…finished! Contrary to Word of Faith teaching, Jesus’ cry didn’t merely mean the completion of the first part of His earthly task. It meant what Bible students for two thousand years have taken it quite literally to mean—that the work of redemption on the cross for all mankind was full, complete, and could not be added to or taken away from. The sacrifice of Himself was enough.

“By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once and for all” (Hebrews 10:10).

It was His body on the cross that bore our sins, not His Spirit, as Hagin and Copeland insist, having to suffer in hell. 1 Peter 2:24 (which Word of Faith disciples are so fond of quoting) tells us in no uncertain terms:

“And He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness, for by His wounds you were healed.”

It was Christ’s blood poured out as an atonement that freed us from sins as final payment for all who would come to Him. In fact, the book of Hebrews, written to believers who knew the Old Testament Law and sacrificial system, presents a definitive case for Christ’s sacrifice by the shedding of His blood. Hebrews, more than any other New Testament book, speaks of sacrificial blood covering over the sins of God’s people until the final sacrifice purged sins forever by His own blood.

We could go on and on. Word of Faith is so unapologetically cultic in its presentation of the Gospel that it rightly falls under the Galatians 1:6 heading of a “different gospel”. Paul’s indictment of those purveyors of the false is recorded in Galatians 1:8-9. Altering the Gospel of Jesus Christ, the very foundation of our faith, is eternally dangerous and those who do so will not escape certain judgment.

You Did What In Church?

The “River” movement has also greatly redefined Christianity so that it is often unrecognizable. The holy Savior of the world has become a God who loves to “party” and get His people stumbling drunk so that there is no difference between their actions and those of the habitual barfly. Women fall down in drunkenness with skirts hiked up indecently, and ministers of the Gospel crawl around on hands and knees, clothing thrashed and having to be assigned designated drivers because they can’t see straight enough to put the key into the ignition. People bark, growl, roar, cluck, act like bulls, fish, karate warriors, and squat immodestly while screaming aloud in order to “birth in the spirit” some illusory “anointing”. For nineteen hundred years such practices were considered reprehensible and fleshly (or demonic), but with twentieth-century sophistication such theology has become suddenly sanctified and those who resist it are dubbed legalists.

We must understand this. Any doctrine that promotes practices or a system of thought alien to the doctrine of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ cannot be from God. These teachings redefine the nature and person of the Godhead, a trait common to every cult in existence. While God alone is the judge of who has or has not gone too far in disregarding the doctrine of Christ (2 John 9), it is inevitable that many in both Word of Faith and the “River” will be led down the widening path of heresy. Once there, it is a difficult thing to return to a Biblical understanding of our salvation. One thing I have discovered in many talk sessions with those involved in these movements is that, no matter what the Scriptural evidence, they simply do not want to hear it. When the truth is presented, the person is at a crossroads. There are only two ways to go, with no middle ground. And so often I have seen believers I have loved choose to side with deception rather than admit they themselves have been participants in deception. This hardness of heart precludes further discussion. It’s impossible to convince someone who simply doesn’t want to hear it. Only repentance will break through to the truth.

Logically Speaking

I don’t know how to put this one tactfully, and for that I apologize. One of the common traits between cult groups and many in the “River” and Christian Charismatic congregations is a nearly complete lack of rational thinking. I know, for both my wife and I were lost in the same fog for twelve years.

Just try telling a Jehovah’s Witness the uncomfortable truth about Charles Taze Russell or Judge Rutherford, or about the duplicity, manipulation, or mind control of the Watchtower Bible And Tract Society. Attempts to show, through their own publications, how their often prophesied end of the world has consistently fallen flat is met with stubborn indignation. Characteristically, they shut their eyes, shake their heads and walk away, refusing to listen, no matter how irrefutable your argument. Two who had entered my home stood up and left abruptly when I began showing them, from the Scriptures, that Jesus is God. They, who profess such deep knowledge of the Word, just didn’t want to hear what the Word had to say about it. To lay bare the truth and look at hard, unyielding facts goes contrary to the slave mentality fostered by their spiritual overseers. They were afraid to use their own God-given intellect to critically examine any presentation contrary to their beliefs.

Tragically, the same is true for much of the Charismatic world.

You see, although we apprehend the truths of the Bible by faith, Jesus didn’t tell us to suspend intelligent questioning. The thought processes that we have are God-given, and He expects us to use them. 1 Corinthians 2:14 is usually cited as proof that we are not to grasp things intellectually, but this argument proves fruitless when followed a few verses down when Paul says that “We have the mind of Christ.”

Romans 12:2 commands us to be transformed by the renewing of our minds. Ephesians 4:23 tells us to be renewed in the spirit of our minds. And Jesus Himself quoted the Old Testament in Mark 12:30 by commanding us that, along with the rest of our being, we are to worship God with all our mind. In all, there are 58 specific, New Testament references to the mind. To disregard such an important part of our makeup is to shut off one major avenue of understanding. Remember, the believer in Christ Jesus has been recreated in His image, and he has been given the very mind of Christ.

The Old Testament, too, has many references to the proper use of human intelligence in our relationship to God. The book of Proverbs has rightly been called a book of common sense.

“For lack of wood the fire goes out;

And where there is no whisperer, contention quiets down” (Proverbs 26:20).

Pretty simple. Without a gossip around, strife ceases to be an issue. It doesn’t take a brain surgeon to figure that out. But God put it into the Scriptures for our learning, and to encourage a little rational thought.

“And according to Paul’s custom, he went to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures” (Acts 17:2).

Acts 18:19 has Paul repeating the same procedure. The Greek word there is dialegomai, meaning to discuss, to address, to preach. Paul went through the Scriptures point by point, demonstrating by the Scriptures that Jesus is the Son of God.

Where did Paul get this attitude of intelligent argument? Perhaps from God Himself.

“Come now, and let us reason together,’ says the LORD” (Isaiah 1:18).

Time and again I have witnessed to people stuck in one of the many tributaries of the “River” and the hyper-Charismatic movement, and very nearly to the last man they reach a point in the dialogue that they simply refuse to listen to sensible argument. Part of the “code of ethics”, if you will, of those in these movements, is not to listen to anyone or anything that may cast a shadow of doubt upon either your teacher or his/her beliefs. These teachers (like those in Word of Faith) are considered so anointed that they are basically looked upon as intermediaries between God and man, and to doubt someone of that status is to doubt God. This kind of attitude was explosively demonstrated by the former pastor of my ex-congregation. Having read Dave Hunt’s and T.A McMahon’s book, “The Seduction Of Christianity” about five years ago, I was very disturbed and asked my wife what she thought of its contents. She decided to take the book to that night’s home fellowship meeting and ask our pastor. When she inquired about the book, he repelled her forcefully.

“I’ve heard about that book and it splits churches!” he derided. He went on for a moment about the persons spotlighted by the book’s authors, who measured the preacher’s practices against the Word of God and found them embarrassingly short of Scriptural integrity. My pastor simply could not, would not countenance any critique of his favored teachers’ doctrine. My wife left in a huff, and while my pastor came by later that night and apologized for the disrespect he showed toward my wife, to the best of my knowledge he never did read “The Seduction Of Christianity”. He absolutely would not consider any evidence of heresy against those he held in high esteem.

I have a mound of paper documentation a foot high documenting a plethora of heresy from Word of Faith teachers and teachers in the “River”, as well as video and cassette tapes of false teaching coming out of their own mouths. Although I’ve offered access to this voluminous documentation to members of my former congregation in order to validate my claims, to this date not one person has called or shown up at my home to avail him/herself of the evidence.

What happens is that the messenger becomes the villain, perceived as impugning the spotless character of certain teachers. Without ever having seen any documentation for themselves, they turn a deaf ear to the truth and accuse of being a malcontent those who discover the heresy and try to present credible evidence.

If we ran our court system in the same convoluted manner, criminals would go free and upstanding citizens who lay their reputation on the line for testifying would be publicly castigated. Damning evidence would be tossed out of court by a judge who refuses to give it an inquiring glance!

This fear of reasoning things out in light of the very Scriptures we claim to believe has led many unbelievers to declare Christians mindless simpletons. They say, and often rightly, that we make a blind leap of faith into a realm which has no basis for intelligent dialogue. Paul said, “I shall pray with the spirit and I shall pray with the mind also” (1 Corinthians 14:15).

It would seem to me that we can safely follow Paul’s lead and utilize the intellect which we have also committed to God’s glory.

I’ve Got A Secret

Although there are yet others, we can touch on one more shared characteristic of cult groups and many Charismatic congregations—secrecy. While Jesus said to Caiaphas that He had spoken openly to the world and not been secretive in word or deed (John 18:20), there are a great many things that the leadership of various Charismatic congregations would not like to have declared aloud. In a meeting with my former pastor and his wife a couple of months prior to my family’s exit from that congregation, it was made very clear to me that one of their main fears was that I would go public with what I knew about the inner workings of the group. They simply did not want to deal with the spiritual fallout of too much openness. In that same meeting, I was angrily corrected by the pastor’s wife that I had dared to preach a Sunday morning message on the errors of Word of Faith theology, and had the temerity to mention Kenneth Copeland as one of its chief proponents. As there were Word of Faith believers in the congregation that morning, she feared repercussions, and rightly so. Stating that my message was a “hard word”, she resented being held responsible to field questions about the sermon all the following week.

Ironically, just prior to my preaching (which I had undertaken with a great deal of personal fear and prayer) she had assured me about three different times to just preach what God laid on my heart. When I did just that, she was shocked and angry.

Incidentally, after six years of eldership and filling the pulpit when the pastor left town, it was the last message I was ever asked to preach.

Why should we be afraid to tell what goes on in our meetings? If it is of God, we should share our experiences—if not, then we should be ashamed. The truth is, many Charismatics are embarrassed by their services, and fear when they bring a loved one to church for the first time. Should a wild vision be proclaimed or an exaggerated manifestation happen, they wonder how the visitor will take it and hope they don’t have a lot of explaining to do. The thought there is that the uninitiated will not understand. Perhaps the point they miss is that understanding is lacking because extrabiblical doctrines and manifestations don’t have a leg to stand on. It shouldn’t take an unbeliever to figure this out. Discernment’s first home should be in the Church.

Even should a loved one be brought to a Sunday service without embarrassment, the discussions and practices of the inner circle of leadership were closely guarded. In some instances this is justified, as when confession of sin takes place. That is a very personal issue between the sinner and His God. But when it comes to things that cannot be found in the Bible—like casting down the “strong man” over a certain geographical area or engaging a Christian in regression therapy with New Age “inner healing” techniques—then we must come clean. The bottom line here is if what we are doing is of God, then it should be declared without fear or apology. If not, then it should be repented of. Freemasonry is an organization founded on secrecy. Christianity is not.

Conclusion

While there are other doctrines bearing striking similarity between common cult groups and much of Charismatic and “River” Christianity, these should be enough. Open dishonoring of the Word of God, preference for bizarre experience over the written text of Scripture, self-styled elitism, a nearly paranoid fear of examining practices in light of God’s Word—these should all be red flags that signal extreme danger.

How does one deal with a situation of discovered heresy within his/her own congregation? Before proceeding any further, know that silence is not an option. As uncomfortable as it is, someone’s voice has to speak out the truth. False doctrine is a cancer that will spread if left unchecked and will consume every unresisting cell in its path. To keep the truth to yourself in order to preserve valued relationships or a supposed unity of the brethren is not love but cowardice. Judgement begins in the house of God (1 Peter 4:17). If we lose every earthly thing for our stand in and our love for the truth, then we still have an enduring inheritance in heaven that does not fade away (1 Peter 1:4).

While every situation is somewhat different, a few basic suggestions may prove helpful.

First, don’t accuse. Nobody likes to be told his beliefs are contrary to the Word of God, and this holds doubly true should the one approached be a teacher of the Word within the congregation. To have to admit to possibly years of gladly receiving and propagating false teaching and honoring false teachers is very traumatic. Some have lost their faith completely and walked away from the Church. As one who formerly taught these same deceptions I was horrified and spent serious time in heartbroken repentance, questioning literally everything I had learned in the previous twelve years. I also felt a great deal of anger at the leadership above me who had introduced these heresies and roundly withstood any attempts by me to correct our doctrine. But the most common response (be prepared for it) is rejection of what you are presenting. Experience is a hard taskmaster, and will not easily emancipate its long-held slaves. If a man has been slain in the spirit a hundred times, reveled in the “anointing”, been enamored of prophecy and superstar prophets, been drunk in the spirit—whatever—to admit that he made a public spectacle of himself without Scriptural support can prove almost unthinkable. It is easier to live in deception and retain a place of authority than to come clean and step into the refreshing (but revealing and embarrassing) light of the truth.

Second, come with a lucid and well-thought-out presentation of facts. Innuendo, rumors, or unsubstantiated, third-hand reports of heretical doctrine or practice simply will not make an impact. The key is to remain credible. This will mean an intensive time of checking and cross-referencing facts until the margin of error on your part is nil. If your presentation is refused, then let it not come because of laziness or inconsistency on your part, but because your pastor or elder will not follow the truth.

Third, remember that a fruit of the Spirit is self-control. A dialogue that has degenerated into name-calling or shouting will earn you the reputation of a troublemaker. While Jesus became angry at false doctrine, He maintained a completely righteous attitude throughout and His enemies had nothing to refute His condemnation. It’s okay to show anger, as the Holy Spirit is grieved over the issue of deception, but make sure it is holy and not vicious. Remember, unless shown otherwise by the Spirit and the Word, these people you are dealing with are brothers and sisters in Christ. One distinction I would make here that I see in the New Testament is that, while the apostles were uncompromising in their stand against false doctrine, their harshest statements are reserved for teachers introducing it into the body of Christ (2 Corinthians 11:13-15, 1 Timothy 1:19-20, 2 Timothy 2:17-18, 2 Peter chapter 2, 3 John 9-10, and the entire book of Jude). As shepherds, the pastors and teachers are the ones charged with protecting the flock, and if instead they welcome the wolf who comes seeking prey (Matthew 7:15), the blood of the sheep is on their hands.

Fourth, pray, pray, pray. Read the Word of God until it is living within you. It helped me immensely to put aside all other books that I had been using for spiritual growth and read only the Scriptures. Not only were my eyes opened to see how my former group had been taking verses out of context and engaging in practices contrary to the Scriptures, it became like a sharp sword to cut away the false.

Lastly, stay until you believe further dialogue is pointless. For me it took a year, and that only after I realized that no one was really interested in change. I had been strung along in the hopes that I would change my mind about these issues and not continue to rock the boat. The very day my wife and I told our pastor we were leaving the congregation, his wife refused to believe it was for good. “When you return,” she said, and I immediately retorted, “We’re not coming back”, she ignored me and continued, “When you return, we will welcome you back.”

In her mind it was us, not her and the remainder of the leadership that needed repentance.

One other point I would mention is—and this is a personal thought some may not agree with—don’t leave quietly. If, after approaching the leadership of the congregation and deciding it is genuinely unresponsive, speak to anyone who will listen. My views were well known throughout the congregation by the time I left, and my wife and I wrote a letter to nearly every member of our former church group outlining, in detail and with confirming Scriptural references, why we could no longer attend church services there. One other couple exited the church after extensive dialogue with me had helped them realize the deceptions being promoted by the leadership, but so far they have been the only ones rescued. My wife and I continue, however, to speak to former congregation members whenever an opportunity presents itself. The leadership of some other church groups in our small community also know our stand and why. We have gone from halting embarrassment to bold witnessing about the tremendous change God has wrought in our lives through study of His Word.

Once exited, meet with like-minded believers as you are able. There is often a season of de-programming (it’s the most apt term I can think of). Years of false doctrine and man’s illusory teachings are not easily shaken off, and learned responses to situations have been carved into our minds. We really do need to be renewed in our thinking (Romans 12:2), and this is best done by immersing ourselves in His liberating Word. Jesus said that if we continue in His Word, then we would know the truth and the truth would make us free (John 8:31-32).

Know also that the anguish accompanying this dealing with heresy will eventually pass. As we keep our eyes on Christ and our heart turned to the simple Gospel of Jesus the light from on high will become more real than ever before, and our assurance before Him at His coming more certain. The Lord is calling His people out from the midst of the false. It is our choice whether to respond.

“Hence, let us go out to Him outside the camp, bearing His reproach. For here we do not have a lasting city, but we are seeking the city which is to come” (Hebrews 13:13-14).

http://www.theothersideoftheriver.com/Articles/Cultism.shtml

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Ex-Word of Faith Testimony of a Joyce Meyers Follower

Damon Whitsell — Tue, 31 Aug 2010 22:06:31 +0000

HAT/TIP to EndTimesPropheticWords

Testimony left at Pulpit Pimps here

Bill, you say that Joyce Meyer doesn’t run a cult, otherwise you wouldn’t be in it. Let me say that the people who are in cults think the same way! Nobody likes to think that they have been deceived,. They want to think they are smart enough to know better. I assure you that if Joyce Meyer teaches the prosperity gospel or that Jesus went to hell so you wouldn’t have to (and she does!), then she IS running a cult, and if you are supporting her, then YOU ARE in a cult and you don’t even know it!

What’s more, there is probably nothing anyone here can say to you that will convince you otherwise, and I for one will not attempt to do so. All anyone here can do for you is speak the truth. It’s up to God and you from there. If God can’t take some of what we say here and get it through to you, then you cannot be reached sir.

A few years ago, I supported Joyce Meyer with everything I had. I regarded her as a true, down to earth, sincere, and prosperous role model. I hung on every word that came out of her mouth as if they were the words of God straight to me. I never missed a show, and if I did, I watched her internet broadcasts. When she held her conferences in my area, I went to see her in person. I would do as she said to prove my commitment to God and take vacation days and drive 3 hours to Tulsa to see her preach at the ORU campus and drive 3 hours back home, justifying myself to God by reminding Him of these sacrifices.

Talking about sacrifice, not only did I give up a day’s pay to see her, but it was nothing for me to sacrifice $100 or more into the white buckets they’d pass around as offering plates, knowing all along that I’d have to sacrifice again when I didn’t have that money to pay a bill with! That, in addition to the hundreds of dollars I’d send her through the mail every month! In the typical Word of Faith fashion, I would then go to God in “prayer” and tell Him what He had to do (you [God] MUST keep your word; you MUST provide ‘pressed down, shaken-together’ etc; if I delight myself in you, you MUST give me the desire of my heart, ad nausea!).

Bill, that’s NOT praying! When a WoF preacher “prays” by saying “we bind you Satan, we come against all the powers of darkness, we rebuke all poverty and lack” etc, they are NOT praying to God! They are talking to the devil and speaking as if they were God Himself. It is NOT prayer. But I digress.

I absolutely LOVED Joyce Meyer! But God had other plans for me. I was DEEP into the Word of Faith . It was all I had ever known all my life. My grandmother latched onto the seed faith teachings of Oral Roberts back when it first came out. She taught my mother in the ways of the WoF, and my mother in turn taught us the same way!

I grew up thanking God for being numbered among those who knew the “truth!” Needless to say, I naturally equated the WoF to be the one and only WILL OF GOD, and anyone who believed otherwise was deceived and damned to hell! That being the case, I grew up feeling at one with all the T.V. ministers. I loved them ALL! As a young boy, I read Copeland’s “The Laws of Prosperity” and I was determined to make those laws work … after all they are LAWS and even God must abide by them!

But taking an honest look back over the past 30 years, I had to admit that they never worked for me. I grew up into my 40’s all along thinking there was something wrong with me. I would actually look at a mustard seed in the spice rack and wonder why my faith was so much smaller that that and didn’t work. Then I would get depressed because my faith was so much tinier than that mustard seed that God wouldn’t honor it.

I felt rejected by God. Sometimes that feeling of rejection made me angry at Him and there were times I actually told Him that he was a liar! That He WAS a respecter of persons; that He showed favoritism, and that He didn’t love me, even though I was doing everything I knew to do to keep with “His” teachings as I was taught them!

All that being said, let me say this: there was nothing wrong with my faith, so don’t even try to tell me “oh ye of little faith!” I’ve heard that all my life and now I know better. My faith was fine, but the problem was that my faith was in a LIE! The “god” I was mad at was NOT the God of the Bible! The “god” of the Word of Faith is a demon straight from HELL! I know that now, but therein lies the danger in Word of Faith teachings. The people in that CULT don’t even know who the TRUE God really is, and are damned as a result!

Back to Joyce Meyer. I supported her “ministry” with ALL of my substance, and I thought she was truly God speaking straight to me. But the more I gave to her, the poorer I got (the story of my life)! It wasn’t until I got down to where I was about to LOSE MY HOUSE the Lord began to act on the anguish inside me. I remember back in 2005, watching Joyce on T.V. One day she was talking about how she had brought her parents to St Louis and bought them a house close to her. She said “I was just in the mood to buy houses!” I almost screamed at her “why don’t you buy MINE for me?”

I pleaded with God to speak to her heart to send me a check and prevent the impending disaster facing me. Then I would know that God really heard me and loved me enough to finally do something after 30 years of giving!

But of course Joyce never did do that, and since I thought she was close to God and had his attentive ear, that it must be that God wanted me to suffer all the more! I couldn’t understand it. I had donated to her (God’s?) ministry, I helped her build her headquarters building and all the furnishings in it. According to her plea for funds back then, I was promised that I would “own” one square foot for each $100 I gave towards it (I gave $300, so I “owned” 3 square feet).

Had God forgotten that ????? Now I was in desperate need, had NOBODY to beg from like she did, and I felt God didn’t care. I told Him He was cruel and mean! But I still loved Him because even then, if I had given up on my ONLY hope, then I REALLY had no hope at all. Even then, I felt that my breakthrough might still come, so I’d pick myself up and apologize to God for my ill will towards Him.

Then one day, as I was watching Joyce on T.V. it seemed like literally “scales” fell from my eyes! Near the end of the show, as she was begging for donations, and her announcer came on talking about all her books that we could have for a “gift” of X-dollars, and then talked about “seeing Joyce in person” and hearing “Joyce preach the word as only she can do.” God Himself spoke to my spirit in that still small voice and told me “this isn’t about God, this is about JOYCE!” “Joyce” this, and “Joyce” that! And all the dollar signs on the T.V. screen seemed to “stick-out” like sore thumbs, and the whole thing smacked of one big long INFOMERCIAL about Joyce Meyer!!

That, my friend, was the beginning of my exodus from the Word of Faith! Each time I saw her show, it got even more disgusting to me … and I stopped giving to her. S L O W L Y, by putting a stop to the hemorrhage of money flowing out of my bank account to these people, I was able to recover somewhat, and I never did lose my house. But it was close. That, my friend was GOD showing me that He really did care about my financial well-being. He didn’t want my money!!!!! And not only did He NOT want my money, I was NOT cursed with a curse if I KEPT it !!!! That is freedom!

About the same time, I just happened to stumble upon this website, Pulpit-Pimps.org, and God has used this site TREMENDOUSLY to teach me the truth about where I had been all my life and that the Lord loved me enough to lead me out of it into the truth!

Unbeknownst to me, my mother, who had raised me in the WoF, had been led out of their heresy about a year before I had! She never told me though. I asked her why, and she said that I would have thought she was backslidden and lost in heresy forever. And she was right. Some other members of my extended family are not convinced, and there is a definite divide – but even that is mentioned in the Bible. That’s why I say that nothing any of us say will EVER convince you of the truth. You will just think that we are deceived and damned to hell. If God doesn’t get through to you, then YOU are not reachable. It’s as simple as that!

I know this is a LONG post, but before I stop there is some more I want to say about the Word of Faith.

The salvation of Jesus Christ is NOT about all the things that the Lord gives to His people! And people who seek the Lord for what He can give them are seeking Him for all the WRONG reasons! A person cannot receive the salvation of Christ unless first he realizes that he is a wretched sinner who deserves HELL, not all of the worldly stuff you WoF people clamor after! It’s not about getting all the STUFF. It’s about giving up their lives for HIM and becoming His slaves. Somehow you Word of Faith people have gotten that all backwards. You think salvation is about getting, and getting more It’s just STUFF, material worldly stuff, it’s CARNAL and ungodly! You think that all your STUFF is proof that you are blessed. There is one thing that is promised for sure to all true followers of Christ and that is PERSECUTION!

You Word of Faithers only think of earthly “blessings”. But God does not promise us the things of this world. Think about it What would it profit you to gain the whole world and lose your own SOUL? Copeland, Benny Hinn, Joyce Meyer, Joel Osteen, Creflo Dollar, Paula White, all of those hellish creatures on TBN – I can’t even name all of the pulpit pimps on TV (and maybe even your pastor too by the way) all of them have their reward. They have their “Best Life Now” But they can’t take any of it with them where they go

What about later on? The Bible speaks of the rich man and Lazarus. That kind of reminds me of the relationship between all these RICH pastors and their pimped followers. I believe they will suffer the same fate!

God does promise us SPIRITUAL prosperity, but you Word of Faith people only think on things of this world. When people like you give expecting your 100-fold return, you are giving to GET !!!! But the true Jesus tells us to give, expecting NOTHING in return. Do any of you honestly do that? Neither are we supposed to give out of NECESSITY or of COMPULSION … tell THAT to all of the pimp preachers on TV who incessantly compel us to give to their ministries ad nausea! It’s WRONG! If any of them really believed what they “preach” then all they really have to do is give and expect their 100-fold return and leave their audiences ALONE! But they won’t ever do that, because they really don’t believe what they preach either. Otherwise they would practice what they preach. YOU are profitable to them, and they fear that if they don’t ask YOU for it, YOU won’t give it to them. YOU are their cash cow, not GOD.

I am not attacking you, so don’t even go there. I am speaking from a life of experience. As I said, I was all bound up and hog-tied in all that Word of Faith crap for almost 30 YEARS!!! I gave, and I gave. I did all of the right things according to our famous PIMPS! It was nothing for me to fork over almost everything I had … tithes and offerings above and beyond what was expected, because I BELIEVED what the pimps said. I thought that I was doing what GOD wanted, and I suffered the consequences of that for far too long.

Like Joyce Meyer always says “give until it hurts!” — “give SACRIFICIALLY!” My intentions were good. And I had faith. But my faith was in a LIE! I was sincere and honest, but I was sincerely and honestly WRONG. I think that the Lord really knew that, and finally got through to me to just STOP IT! Like, HELL-OOOOO! If this thing still doesn’t work after nearly 30 years, guess what – IT DOESN’T WORK!!

I see myself all over all of you defenders of these people. I was just like ALL of you. And a couple of years ago, I would have been standing right there by your side. That’s why I say that ONLY THE LORD will ever get through to you. Nobody could have EVER gotten through to me so I know that.

I guess you can tell I am just a little bit angry about this lie that is continuously propagated by the deluge of televangelists spewing this prosperity vomit into living rooms across this country and bringing millions to hell with them. But maybe somehow the Lord can use my experience to help lead someone else out of this DELUSION you call faith. It is another gospel, and the “Jesus” you think you worship will someday be crystal clear to you. I just hope that you find out who it really is before it’s too late. REALLY! The Bible is the truth, and it contains the way to the real Jesus. This Word of Faith gospel is pure MADNESS !!!!!

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Ex-Word of Faith Testimony of Kevin Rhodes

Damon Whitsell — Tue, 22 Jun 2010 18:19:23 +0000

Kevin is another Ex-WoFer that graduated from Rhema but now is very vocal against the Word of Faith Movement. You can see Kevins website here. ITCHING EARS

THANKS KEVIN!!!

We apologize that this testimony would not format correctly, making it hard to read.

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My name is Kevin Rhodes. Christ found me at age 12 at a local VBS.

Though I did not understand what was going on inside me I knew there was something real. Teenage life hit hard and at the age of 17 something inside was completely tired of my life and the way it was. I knew I wanted God in it. I began going to a local foursquare church with a neighbor. The church wasa very welcoming place. The majority of the members were retirees and glad to see youth like myself and friends desiring God and sharing what he was doing in our lives. I was dressed like a youth and had long hair.

Regardless of this most of the people loved us as if we were thier own children. The love of Christ truly abounded here.We were given opportunity to share often and it was encouraging. We held services and saw many peoples lives touched in a real way. God did some really cool things. As time progressed, we would join evangelistic tent meetings and revivals in our town. Most were good and fruit was evident. Some however were not.

As time passed, some in our group felt they needed more. Many were from a local Word of Faith church that had turned sour. God had brought these folks to our church and though not as “holy ghost shakin” as thiers was, they liked the people. Thier mentality was that it was not enough to walk in the love of God and see people born again, but they and the rest of us”needed” the fire. We would go twice to the Believers Convention in Fort Worth and to the Motorcycle rally sponsored all by Kenneth Copeland.

We continued local services at our home base and then one day were presented the opportunity to go to a Thursday night youth group at another church, locally. We started going regularly. There were lots of kids that seemed to really love God. They were all cool to us and before long we began helping out as leaders. My friend could not wait to leave the first church and join this one. As we were best friends, I decided to follow suit. Some of our other friends were not inclined to do the same so remained at the former congregation. My best friend told me that this church had a connection with Kenneth E. Hagin, the author of many of the books he was reading. We joined the new church at the beginning of Summer 1996. Some youth leader friends of ours were moving up to Tulsa to attend a bible college called Rhema Bible Training Center in July. I had a vehicle so offered to take these folks and thier stuff up there. I would stay with a friend and attend the seminars. While there, I would sense a leading to attend the school even knowing as little about it as I did.

I came home, packed up and left much to the suprise and dismay of my family. I would receive 2 years of intense indoctrination. I enjoyed the time I was there and the people I met. I do not regret my time there, even now, it was all a part of God’s plan.

During my time at school, my first church, would assist me financially although I had stopped attending. The Rhema church did not. When I would return home, my first church would invite me to share about school with the congregation. I was not even calling it home yet they extended love, care, and compassion regardless.

School was very formal and I worked to support myself through it. I did not pick up on any major flaws with the Word of Faith exept for the controlling nature of the pastor of Rhema Bible Church, Kenneth W. Hagin, the founder’s son. He would instruct the students that they not only could not but would not be allowed to attend any other churches other than his while they were at bible school. He stated that if someone did they would attain nothing after leaving school. He stated that the church would know based on sunday school attendance records and tithing records. As stupid and fearful as I was at the time, I obeyed. This is my number one regret. A few other students did not listen nor did they care. I hated the style of everything at the church but went in fear. I really should have gone to another outreach church there in Tulsa. Such is the power of fear.

Your first year in school is general studies of the “tenants” of faith. It covered courses on money, your position in Christ, bible history, etc. Your second year is the year you choose what direction you thing God is leading you. It could be Youth service, general laity, pastors childrens workers or music ministers. After your second year is almost over, the teachers at the school prepare you to”go out” and spread thier gospel.

I did not know what to do at all so I returned home to work in the Rhema church. During the time I was in school, my parents and younger brother would begin to attend the WOF church. My brother and Dad would be greeter and usher. As I did not have a desire to serve in that capacity, I would opt to help in the Childrens ministry.

After coming back, I could not forget the kind deeds done for me by the good people at my first church. They told me they would love to have me volunteer there and teach sunday school.

I expressed to the pastor at the WOF church my desires and he stated that if I were to leave I would lose everthing I had gained positionally at his church. He said I would have to reclimb the ladder, starting at rung #1.

Once again, I succumbed to fear. However, at every opportunity I would sneak over to the other church to fellowship with them.

As time passed, I would see small glimpses of how the WOF would deal with its people in abusive ways. These corrections or public rebukes stem from Shepherding practices but are used widely in the WOF.

Around this time the prosperity message gained popularity. Global economics were strong and people seemed to be ok with giving in abundance. The WOF church was small and could hardly pack in all the people wanting to come see the excitement. Soon itinerant ministers would come in and “encourage” the congregation to give and give big. We heard it both ways. One way stated that God would curse you for not giving big and tithing. The other way said you would be blessed 10,000 times more than you were. All of it was misinterpreted scripture after the next to dupe people into giving. Before long, Pastor would drive a new car or two. Soon after, a new house. New suits and big donations to other”ministries”. Big preachers.Fancy slogans like “days of heaven in 97″, “it will be great in 98″, “divine in 99″, etc.

I gave away my savings. A friend gave away so much he had his lights turned off and car repo’ed. Where was the church for him? Oh, he must not have had the faith. All the while those at the top dressed to the “T” and ate 5-star.

The church would go through an expansion and get a face lift. Around the same time I would be given opportunity to lead a prosperity bible study at the “college” on the WOF church campus. I loved it and enjoyed it. As I was teaching I would begin to see holes in the doctrines I was teaching but did not know where to go with it. This was Spring of 1999. A friend and roommate from Rhema would return from the mission field back to Lubbock where his brother pastored a church and he had a “word” for me and my best friend. I was always a little cautious as a “word”, while at Rhema could be something encouraging, complete and utter nonsense, or a way to control someone wit words of fear or intimidation.

His “word” would change my life for the better. I don’t think he even knew.

He would challenge me to research the scriptures dilligently to see if what was taught actually was so. He challenged us on the excess taught by all WOF & charismatics. The previous night in our college prosperity class I had seen inconsistencies. It was very fitting and timely. I could hardly wrap up the college course on prosperity. I had to apologize and repent to the class of 4 people. Though I did not see entirely how it was off, it was enough for me to see the fault.

The weeks following I would withdraw from social church activities and serving. Eventually I would stop going to service. I would read the bible for hours at a time, studying with help from expository dictionaries and concordances. I did not study any books besides these, I wanted to know this for myself from the bible.

Before delving into all other subjects, I wanted to talk to my friend and maybe the pastor about what had transpired and my findings. I met with my buddy and talked to him further(he was with me when our friend confronted us) about the false prosperity message. He said he understood my concerns and would talk to the pastor. Upon our meeting the next time he stated that the conversation went something like this: “Everybody has a different revelation on prosperity”. That was it. I pressed him once more to press the issue with the pastor. Could I have had the stomach, I would have talked to him myself. My friend stated that he would not confront him again for fear that he would lose his position in that ministry(he had just been promoted to pastor of a small satellite church in a neighboring town).

For the next several months I would research every “tenant of faith” the WOF claimed. The majority were based on bent scripture and false revelation.

In the years to follow, I would struggle with bitterness. God would have to deal with my heart on the issue and show me the power of deception. I do still believe that when a person is confronted with irrefutable truth and chooses thier own revelation, pride, or financial status over the truth , they are no longer deceived but are willingly in error. They live to serve themselves.

Throughout all of this journey I knew/know Christ is with me longing to do good and right. While I changed, Christ in me did not. He is present to do his will and good pleasure.

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VIDEO: Saved From The Prosperity Gospel

TWotWoF VIDEO ROW — Sun, 25 Apr 2010 10:56:22 +0000

The story of how God delivered one couple from the subtle deception of the prosperity gospel. The full interview is available here: http://www.harborhawaii.org/beta/601

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Word of Faith Testimony of Hank Edwards (John Edwards Brother)

Damon Whitsell — Thu, 18 Mar 2010 08:16:38 +0000

My Brother Hank And The Word Of Faith Cult

My Experience With The Word of Faith Denomination

Disclaimer.
Before you criticize me and judge me as a hypocrite or sinner, know this! I am both.

I have had plenty of bad church experiences or “Hurts” since I was six and a half years old. I remember walking to church, 85th street Baptist Church in east lake (Birmingham, Al) with my family because we did not have a car. My parents were around the age of 37 or 38 and lived very modest (down right poor) if the truth be known. My father was dying of a brain tumor, yet he walked with the rest of us to church. Before you conjure up images of a wholesome God fearing man, he was not, At least not until his recent conversion to Christianity. Prior to that he was a Chief Petty Officer in the United States Navy who had just returned home from Vietnam. He was pretty much in the religious category of an atheist. My mother was raised Methodist and pretty much turned to the Baptist faith. I was the middle child of their three boys. I watched and observed my father, who was my childhood hero and pretty much still is turn from a very Hollywood type handsome looking Sailor who wore a great looking uniform to work, to a man who became bald headed, very thin, and very weak. I remember the constant trips to the hospital he took when an ambulance came to our house to take him. I also remember the anger I felt when the neighbors would stand on their porches and watch with pity and fascination. They were watching the man of the house die and I was too young to grasp what the obvious should have told me. Instead, my mother and her gift of words simply and bluntly told me when he was gone. I still think it was the loudest telephone ring I ever heard and when she answered the phone that was in the living room by saying Hello, then yes, then hanging up the phone she said. Your Daddy is dead! I remember the image that came to my mind was an empty turtle shell. A teacher had told me the turtle was dead while I was looking at it. That was what death meant to me, an empty shell. The irony is that I felt empty instantly. I could not breathe for almost a full minute I was so heart broken and sad. I did not cry and I did not understand why I did not cry because I had never hurt so deeply in my soul. I do not remember the first of thousands of cries I had from missing my father.

During the months of my father dying with a brain tumor I remember the church people bringing a hospital bed and setting it up in my parent’s room for my dad to lie in. I remember the endless line of church visitors and the gifts or food they would bring. The special feeling I would feel from so many that cared. It wasn’t until a short time after my father’s death that I was at church and walked into a storage room there and saw my dad’s hospital bed leaning against a wall. Empty. I remember just standing there and looking at it. I remember the sadness of my dad’s bed. Empty. I remember the sadness being replaced with anger when I realized that after he died all the people stopped coming. No more church members with the exception of the Bookout’s. They were an older couple who continued to come visit us occasionally of the next few years and always remembering to bring us a little toy. But the rest just quit coming. Why? I was just too young to understand but I remembered the anger. It wasn’t long before we were just the white trash members of the church. Those Edwards kids! They are always playing too hard, and always making noise. It wasn’t long after that when we Edwards’s kids got the blame when all the kids were just too noisy having fun. I remember once when my brother and I skipped Sunday school to roam the halls of this enormous church. We got caught by a Deacon who berated us and grabbed my younger brother and me by the arm squeezing it very hard and hurting me. I was scared and I distinctly remember thinking he wouldst dare do that if my dad was alive. How right I was. Incidents like this happened often. Later in our pre-teen years my brother and I had a friend named Reggie. He was our age and black. At that time the church had a gymnasium and recreation center that the church kids could go to during the summer and play until our hearts were content. One day we invited Reggie and went and had a wonderful time. I remember when Reggie had to go home my brother and I stayed to play more. After Reggie left, the director who was one of the world’s nicest men came up to me and grabbed my shirt at the collar and physically lifted my face to his by my shirt. He told me, “Don’t you ever bring another damn nigger here!” He whispered other sweet nothings to me but I can’t remember what they were. It doesn’t matter. I was never a good student but that lesson was learned on the first take. Some Christians huh? Well it was culture in those times right? Our and there’s! Whatever! It just went along with the rest of the hypocrisies I learned there. I bounced around here and there during my life at one church or another, never finding a place to call home so to speak. My older Brother John who was always interested in the bible and church more than I was decided to leave the Birmingham police force to go into the ministry. This time it was quite different. He was captivated with his new found religious philosophy in the Word of Faith Denomination. What I only knew as Charismatic. He left the state with his family in tow to school in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma. He would learn from the great Kenneth Hagen at Rhema Bible College. He would stay there two years and attend school with his wife Coni. He ate it up breakfast, lunch and supper. When he returned two years later to start his own church, I decided I would help him. I started listening to his teachings about this type of faith that I found to be new to me and I decided to give it a try. Why not? I sure wasn’t impressed with the great leaders of faith in my own church experience. Besides, I had to help my brother right? By this time I was working night shift as a police officer and had some time during the day or afternoon to help. Pastor John, my brother, started meetings in his home. His first church meeting was in his living room and was attended by the obligatory family and maybe a friend or two. Understand. This means there were about five or six people other than John’s family present. Ha! Funny. Little did I know that in a few short years this living room preacher would be flying all over the world preaching and have his on T.V. show rubbing elbows with Richard Scrushy, professional athletes,
and other big names. But here we were in his living room in Trussville, Alabama. Having church and listening to this new faith. All you have to do is have faith. The concept attracted me instantly. After all, when you have nothing in life but bills, faith is pretty much all you have left. Pastor John taught me all the streets and avenues of faith. How I could speak into existence all the money I needed to support my family, to become successful in whatever I chose to do, to be healed of any sickness, and go to heaven when I die to boot! I thought, Hell yes, that sounds good to me. So I continued to help my Brother build. His heart was in the party district of Birmingham which is known as South Side. This is where all the college kids, homosexuals, freaks, and ghouls are known to hang out. I went with my brother pounding the streets of South Side passing out flyers, talking to strangers and inviting them to his new church the Edge. We nearly got into fights outside of the bars. People did not realize that these two church dudes were police officers or use to be and that we grew up fighting, and despite trying to build a church we were still dealing with anger problems. Fortunately, the close calls of having street fights were avoided. Cooler heads prevailed. We went high and low in every corner of the Godless South Side of Birmingham seeking church visitors. Before long we rented a Knights of Columbus building to serve as our church. Very slowly but surely people came. We had our share of clowns, kook’s and weirdo’s visit. I remember having to work bathroom duty. It was my job to make sure that when children visited the bathroom no adults followed them in. That is how wacky some of our visitors were. I had personal friends of mine from work, other friends to visit. John had his family and their friends plus all the new visitors that would come and go. Eventually the Edge started to grow. We had a talented band that replaced not so talented music. We had Christian Alternative / Rock concerts that drew a few interested youth. We had fun! And for once I felt as though I was really serving the lord. I was passionately serving the Lord and my brother by assisting to build a church. Imagine me, a church builder! And yet I was. I also believed and conformed my thinking to the name it and claim it recipe of faith. After all, it was right there in the bible. Pastor John flipped through the bible from scripture to scripture that clearly spoke of these principals. I applied them to my life. I used the prayers, spoke the language and recited positive professions of faith. It was getting me nowhere fast. At the time I was in financial dire straights and struggling on a policeman’s salary. Trying to support a family and still believing in moving mountains in my life. The church was growing. The money was trickling in. I know, because I was the one taking and counting the offerings. I remember thinking this could be quite a money making business. Mostly it was money that started the first problems between my brother Pastor John and me. No, he wasn’t stealing the money or misusing it. However, we had our disagreements on how it should be used. Pastor John was the boss. The one and only boss and I was just me. Bigger people started getting involved in the Edge church. People, who Pastor John began confiding in and making plans while putting me outside of the circle of big things that were happening, People with big money, or people who gave big money began to take my duties. Now I began to think Wait a damn minute, who was it that was there going into grungy south side clubs, walking miles and miles of streets passing out flyers, giving rides to strangers to church while these Johnny Come Lately’s come in taking over responsibilities? I began to perceive that those who gave more money became the key people in the politics of the church. I was right. Give and you shall receive. I gave. I gave what I could. I even bounced a check by mistake that cost me dearly as anyone who has ever been broke has. Did my positive confessions work? Well, it didn’t cover the bounced check, I can promise you that. Neither did the church, nor my brother. I remember asking my brother. Why did this happen? My answer was that maybe I left a window open for sin to creep into my life which stole my blessing. Gee thanks! I feel better now. Maybe I could be a crack head and get the blessing from the church to help me with my next fix. I guess the crack heads that came for help had tightly sealed windows in their lives. No room there for the window thief to steal they’re blessings. It didn’t take long for me to see that this Word of Faith message had a built in excuse for everything that didn’t work. Why didn’t sister so and so get healed of her cancer? Why did brother so and so die? Did he have sin in his life? Oh my! Well what human being doesn’t? My questions or doubts began to build up quickly once I was pushed out of the inner circles of the divinely blessed Edge church members. I began pointing out hypocrisies or personally perceived wrongs of this church until my brother and I finally fell out and my family and I who worked our butts off at our own expense to play a large part of building this church. I turned in my key and left. I again spiraled down into a bitter anger towards my brother and church altogether. Before long the Edge church was financially ready to move on to a better church building in Trussville, Alabama. My brother seemed to have lost his desire or heart for South Side. I personally thought that the money would be more plentiful in Trussville. I was right! Again. The Edge moved onto Trussville and grew. The months went by and I had been moved to day shift on patrol. I happened to drive into a beautiful cemetery where the tombstones are old and really neat to look at. My pager went off and I saw that the numbers 911 followed my younger brother’s phone number. Naturally, the page horrified me. What could it be? I called and learned that my Niece, Jennifer had been rushed to Children’s Hospital in Birmingham by ambulance and that she was in “Bad shape”, it doesn’t look good.” I immediately left work and went home to get my wife. My younger brother Terry had explained that they had found that Jennifer had a brain tumor and was in a coma. How could this be? Jennifer was in perfect health. She was fourteen years old for crying out loud! Although I was deeply hurt and still angry with John, I of course went to the Hospital to be with them and to be there with Jennifer. I immediately began making my positive confessions. I prayed for instant healing and recovery for Jennifer. I begged God to heal her and remove the cancer from her head. I fully leaned on my faith and sincerely believed for a miracle. I believed in life for her despite my faith in brain tumor’s being weak. I convinced myself that Jennifer would live and the cancer would die. The following 48 hours were a blur of prayer, hope, and desperation. It consumed me. I grieved for my brother, Coni, and Jennifer’s two brothers Lee and Brian. What torment must they be enduring? Church member’s, family, friends, and co-workers streamed through. Prayers were lifted to God to spare our loved one. I remember going into see Jennifer. She looked like she was asleep. She was warm to the touch. Instantly, selfishly, all the memories came freshly to my mind of instances where I could have treated her better, showed her my love for her better. The tears rolling down my face were hot with self loathing. Regret. I was her Uncle. Some Uncle I was! The monitors with there numbers were explained to me by John and Coni. Coni was a Registered Nurse. I looked at the numbers and readings on the equipment and begged God for them to change. To show signs of recovery. I remember an Evangelist finally came after repeated request, a big shot in the Word of Faith Ministry. He came to pray for Jennifer. I remember the relief I felt. The renewed hope. Then later in the early morning hours when the Doctor came to John and he left the waiting area. I prayed, I confessed. When he returned he spoke to the crowd gathered for the news. He explained that Jennifer was essentially brain dead and only living through life support. He further explained they would be removing her from life support. I cried. I cried hard. I felt the realization dawn on me that these positive confessions did not work. I was angry, hurt, and desperate. Later in the morning the family gathered at Jennifer’s bedside for our earthly good byes. I told her I loved her, kissed her warm forehead and told her good bye. As a family we all sang Jesus Loves You there in her I.C.U. room. It was sung with tremendously saddened voices. But it was at the same time the most beautiful I have ever heard it sung. It was true. Jesus loved Jennifer more than even we did. God’s will was done. For whatever reason, for whatever good that God’s plan for Jennifer was, it was out of our human control. No prayer could change the outcome. No positive confession worked despite the sincere faith in which it was confessed. Jennifer entered heaven. Our faith and our prayers were no match for God who needed her and wanted her with him. We don’t understand the intricacies of the details in God’s plan. We are too simple of creatures to understand. We can not manipulate them regardless of how desperately we try. Once again, through the bonding of Jennifer’s death my brother and I worked out our relationship. Again my family joined the church we help to build. I listened intently and again tried to have faith in the message although there was internal conflict in my soul over it. I would never again believe in the word of faith religion even while I chose to be involved. I watched further growth in the Edge Church. Many, many people joined and I saw that the church had even out grown its new building again. The money poured in. Pastor John continued to preach the message and had once told me that his window was left open with his fighting with me that allowed the devil inside to steal his daughter. I’m sure John would argue he said this, but he did. Maybe it was anger. Maybe it was frustration or even his hopeless attempt to make an excuse so that he could continue to believe that his belief did not fail him. I printed and saved the e-mail in which he told me this for proof as I always have for hate e-mail in which I call it from people who write and say things they may later deny. I understood it from his point of view. We always need a scapegoat for our belief when things happen that contradict how we believe. I essentially felt like John blamed me for his daughter’s death after our second falling out. That is a hard one to forgive. In fact I didn’t forgive him for several years. I didn’t even speak to him for several years until we had a phone conversation that went down hill very quickly. I told John that he was a False Prophet in that phone conversation between very vulgar words. I also meant it. I believed my brother was caught up in a false religion and I told him so. I told him he was a leader of a cult. I was right! I even prophesied to him. I told him his church would grow huge, that he would become very successful until his people figured him out and quit him. I told him he would lose everything and fall right on his face. You see, I believed this to be true. My brother has a unique talent. He is a natural born leader. I wish I had that talent. Nothing could stop me. He can walk into a crowded room and within minutes have everyone’s attention and have them believe whatever story he had to tell them. I knew he would get big. He did. He traveled the world preaching. He grew churches in Africa, They still exist. His ministry went throughout Europe and Africa. He made huge money and had a huge following. And then it happened. I was right. His people turned on him. They threw him out despite that he visited them when their family was sick in the hospital, preached their families funerals, married their couples, counseled their marriages, counseled they’re cheating wives and husbands. He was there for them all and they threw him out like yesterday’s news. They were done with him without any concern of his welfare. What I was dead wrong about was that Pastor John had finally saw what he was doing was wrong. He saw that he was duped by the very religious belief he was teaching. God spoke to his heart and showed him that he was taking scripture out of its original contextual meaning and purpose and using it to twist it into a formula that would benefit his own selfish desires. After John’s revelation of truth, John did only what a true man could do. He admitted his fault and wrong doing to his congregation. From that point on he preached the scripture as it was written, in the context it was written, for the people it was written for. The deacons of the church were furious. He was stealing their opportunity to speak into existence the things they desired by using particular bible verses as a foundation for their faith. What Pastor John began to preach did not go over with them well at all. They ousted him and gave him the full swift kick of the left foot of fellowship. You see, it is my belief that people are desperate to believe in something they can obtain if they have the power to obtain it. What a perfect religion. Having eternal life, full control of your life, health, prosperity, success, riches, who wouldn’t want to believe that? But the plain and simple truth is that this belief requires you to put faith in faith, not in God. That is the error of this message in my opinion. It is so easy to be deceived by a con man who calls himself a preacher when you have desperate, unhealthy, poor, ordinary people searching for a better existence being told by a man of God that they can have all of this and eternal life if they tithe, confess positive confessions, live sinless and have faith in faith. Before long all you will be having is faith that produces nothing if you are not having faith, total faith in God. The preacher gets rich. The people keep feeding him money hoping for a return. I share this as my own experience. Those who know me know I am far from perfect. I struggle just to be good. I am not trying to put anyone down in their belief but merely trying to warn that there are things in this religion behind the scenes that are not seen. I have been there. Are they all bad? No. No, unless they are placing faith in faith, before placing faith in God. My brother John, Pastor John, has been humbled in a severe way. He has asked forgiveness sincerely and I know this by seeing something I have never seen in him in 42 years. He puts others first for the first time in his life and he truly believes in God. Jesus is his savior and he knows Jesus forgives. It takes courage to man up and confess when you are wrong. It takes even more when you have been broadcast publicly, and traveled the world doing wrong and then apologized and changed. I am proud of my brother. He is doing right and doing the best he can and he has a true heart for people and a true heart for God. We are once again friends as well as brothers.

http://junkerjorge1.blogspot.com/2009/11/my-brother-hank-and-word-of-faith-cult.html

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Word of Faith Testimony of Jeanette Largent

Damon Whitsell — Thu, 18 Mar 2010 07:51:52 +0000

HEALING THE WORD OF FAITH MOVEMENT: REVELATION FORM THE LAST ROW… HANDICAPPED SECTION.

‘Don’t drink the Kool Aid’

My son and I attended a Benny Hinn crusade. My son had a short time to live. Born paralyzed, ventilator dependent, he was barely clinging to life. But he was alert. He wanted to play like other kids and I could feel his frustration. My heart was broken, but my faith in God was soaring. We were going to a Benny Hinn meeting! We walked in with two or three hundred other wheelchair bound people, of different ages, with their families. There was excitement in the air, being full of faith and expectation to see the miracles we’d only heard about. We were led to the last row in the back, away from the view of the cameras. We attended seven more crusades with Hinn just like this one and with other leaders in the Word of Faith. We never saw one person healed, although claims were made that some got up from their wheelchairs, there was not one. One day, 16 years later, I was praying and felt angels rejoicing in heaven. 3 days later, my son’s heart stopped and he entered heaven. Two years later, our Word of Faith Pastor passed away from cancer. We learned from all this that we are saved by grace, not our by works or the words of faith. Praying for Healing for the Word of Faith Church. www.myspace.com/daughterofjerusalem

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Ex-Word of Faith Testimony of RickyD

Damon Whitsell — Wed, 17 Mar 2010 03:43:28 +0000

Rick D’s ex-Word of Faith Testimony from http://rickyd2000-walkingwiththelord.blogspot.com/

The testimony of my involvement with Word of Faith and Charismatic movement spans for a period of 22 years. How I left the wacky world of Word of Faith/ Charismania is what I will be sharing here. It was in 1987 that a business partnership went bad, my wife and I were facing a looming disaster with the possibility of a foreclosure, losing the business, and our whole lives being crushed all at the same time.

The a few years before this I rededicated my life to the Lord Jesus with the birth of my daughter. I found out that most of my in-laws were born again Christians and started to hang around my 2 brother-in law who were involved with Full Gospel Businessmen Fellowship International. It was at this time that I started to watch Christian TV, and found out about the prosperity gospel through Kenneth Copeland, Frederick Price, Benny Hinn and the Word of Faith. It seemed like a God send at the time, concerning the huge financial problems I was facing, but I was to find out later that the false gospel of prosperity was an abject failure.

It was at a Full Gospel dinner that a new Pastor out of Rhema Bible Training center was opening up a new Church in Bethel Ct. so we all decided to attend. The indoctrination into word of faith began. The first thing you are taught is tithing, so I went jumped in with both feet. I was giving offerings to all the TV ministries, you name it and I gave to Copeland, Tilton, Price, Oral Roberts, Full Gospel and the Word of Faith Church I was attending.

I was totally caught up in this doctrine as the way out of my problems. Little did I realize that I was getting deeper in debt. The time was getting closer that the business had to be sold or just walk away. At the time it was my wife and I were working 14 hrs a day 6 days a week just to keep the business running so that we could sell it. A dear Christian brother who went home to be with the Lord a few years, heard of our dilemma and offered to work for us for whatever we could pay him.

What a blessing that was for my wife and I especially with a young daughter in tow. Sal and I would pray every day that the Lord to send the customer’s in to the store. The Lord honored our prayers and were able to keep the business running till a buyer became interested. My sister in law was committed to the Word of Faith teachings and told me to walk around the store 7 times and the Lord would sell the business. I was desperate, instead of reading my Bible and communicating with God. I walked around the store 7 times, because she said Joshua did it in Jericho,but what she left out was that God told Joshua to march around the walls of Jericho and then blow the trumpet and then God cuased the walls to fall down from the inside out. This is the type of false teaching that comes out of Rhema it is based on pure superstition.

The only way that we could sell the business was to take a down payment which payed the vendors and a monthly payment for a year which the buyer eventually defaulted. In turn my one bedroom condo was foreclosed on and my family left Connecticut and moved to Naples Florida in 1994. All of this happened at a time of going to a Word of Faith Church, attending Full Gospel meetings giving tithes and offerings all over the place. I felt like an abject failure because of what people were saying that I didn’t have enough faith thats why all this stuff happened to me.

At the time the Word of Faith Church was becoming more and more legalistic. The teachings of Kenneth Hagin were not working, I bought up every book possible such as You can write you own ticket with God and Authority of the Believer. Nothing was working as it was preached name and claim it, confess it and posses it. I mean all this false teaching was failing and my walk with the Lord was suffering. Full Gospel was devolving into a bless me club as they embraced the next false prophet that blew into town who was full of himself and not the Holy Spirit. There was a Jezebel spirit running loose in the Word of Faith Church I was attending, no it is called sin and the Pastor had to step down because he was involved in adultery as well as the Music Minister. I left the church before everything blew up. I was on my way out of the Charismatic life, but I still loved the Lord and was determined to know Him and serve Him in a greater way. I changed Churches and started attending an Assembly
of God Church in Stamford CT. for a year then it was time to to Florida.

Once in Florida I tried many different Charismatic Churches that preached the gifts of the Spirit but never saw any evidence of the Gifts in operation. Charismatic Christianity was becoming more and more of a side show. The Jim Baker scandal, Jimmy Swaggart scandal,Robert Tilton scandal. Every one of the scandals in ministry had a corresponding blow of lack of trust and integrity with these TV preachers. You can go right down the line, the scandals are too numerous to mention. It did have an effect on me and it caused me to question what were my real beliefs and allowed me time to dedicate my time to study the Bible more and know what God’s Word really says and how to apply it in my life.

For about 10 years I was in a dry spot with the Lord and I was dry, going through the travails of life, numerous surgeries and now dealing with prostate cancer. My sister-in-law told me about a wonderful non denominational Church that she was attending and ask me to go to a service. I started to attend services, but didn’t go regularly due to the fact of surgeries and going back to college to get my degree.

Once I graduated college and surgeries were finished. I started to attend the non denominational Church regularly and attend a weekly Bible study. The diagnosing of prostate cancer caused me to get right with God very quickly. I started to realize that my relationship with Him was not as it should be. As the Pastor preached his sermon on Sundays I became more and more aware of the catch phrases positive negative and faith, almost every sunday sermon ended with a faith conclusion which I heard being preached before in the Word of Faith in CT. Bells and whistles started going off in my mind. Could it be possible that I would be attending a Word of Faith Church again. Yes it was possible, upon further research I found out that the Pastor was a graduate of Rhema and that the Associate Pastor was also a graduate of Rhema. I did not leave a Word of Faith Church in Ct to only go back in one here in Florida. Whether the Pastor preaches Word of Faith or Word of Faith lite it is still from
Rhema.

I brought this to the attention of my brother and sister in law and they said to me the Pastor is not preaching Rhema doctrine, but it sure sounded like it to me.

After one Sunday service in which the Pastor mentioned that every one in the congregation should buy Charles Capps book The Tongue the Creative Force, I had it and left the Church. You see for the last 6 months there were many references to Rhema doctrine but it is so subtle that if you are not keyed into to the message it would fly over your head and would not catch it. Combined with the Todd Bentley’s false revival of last year the Lord had me on a true search of where the Charismatic, Healing revivals and Word of Faith intersected. The picture that developed was horrific, add to Joseph Chambers expose on Kenneth Hagin and the Spirit of Serpent in which a Holy Ghost turned into a laughing debacle in which Hagin was full of demon spirits causing people to slither out of their seats and hissing at everyone. I had it I had to move on and put this Charismatic chaos behind me.

I have been attending the Fist Baptist Church here in Naples FL for the last month and half and I am now a member and happy to be out of that Charismatic Chaos that I was involved with for all those years. Praise the Lord because Jesus has set me free!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Ex-Word of Faith Testimony of a Former Kenneth Haginite

Damon Whitsell — Wed, 17 Mar 2010 03:32:54 +0000

FROM http://formerhaganite.blogspot.com/2009/03/miscarriage-disaster.html

Miscarriage Disaster

While attending Rhema, my wife thought she was pregnant midway through the our second year. We already had four and thought of another one at this time was too much. She was going to school, taking care of the house and kids plus we had started another business so I wouldn’t have to be gone from home all the time.

She didn’t say anything to me for a time. She found herself thinking about not wanting a child. She was very distressed about it. She regretted it. She wished she could change it. She was just so busy right now. We both love kids. At any other time she would have been delighted.

A few weeks later she began to spot. Then she began bleeding more heavily. She finally told me about the pregnancy. She was worried now because she lost our first child due to a miscarriage. She went to the doctor and he said the fetus had died and she would have to have a D&C.

She started to become depressed. She felt she had brought this on by her negative thoughts and maybe she even confessed she didn’t want this baby. She thought she had created this situation. She had committed a mental abortion of the child. After all, at Rhema they taught us that negative confessions will produce negative results. Surely, this was her fault.

She had the D&C and I thought that was the end of it. I knew we both felt real bad losing another child like that. I didn’t know what was going on in her head though. She was very distressed. She kept feeling very guilty that she had brought this into existence by her negative confession. She was tormented. So much so she quit school just 2 months from graduation. She felt she had lost her salvation. She felt alone and God had abandoned her.

She had become another casualty of the Word of Faith teaching. What you confess is what you will possess. You can have what you say. Write your own ticket with God or the devil if you don’t confess properly, I guess.

To this day she still cries when she talks about this. Did she cause this child to die in her womb because of a negative confession? She doesn’t believe that any longer but it did take a toll.

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Junker Jeorge: The Dangerous Kenneth Hagin Cult

Damon Whitsell — Wed, 17 Mar 2010 01:20:10 +0000

The Dangerous Hagin Cult

I wanted to warn you against the dangers of being involved in the Word of Faith Movement, which gains most of it’s doctrine from the teachings of Prophet Kenneth Hagin.

The Word of God is very clear in warning Christians not to add or take away from the Bible, and to accept no other Gospel or revelations. Many sincere believers have had their lives and faith ruined and shipwrecked by the teachings of Kenneth Hagin and his followers.

Kenneth Hagin claimed to have had at least eight meetings with Jesus Christ, some of which were for hours at a time. In these claimed visions, Kenneth Hagin received many revelations that he claims were given to him face to face by Christ. The Apostle Paul warned about this in Galatians Chapter one. Kenneth Hagin made many failed and inaccurate prophecies. The Scriptures clearly teach that if a prophet’s word does not come to pass, then we are not to believe that He spoke for God. I have been in the same room with him when he made predictions that failed.

Much of Kenneth Hgain’s theology can be found in the New Age writings of EW Kenyon whom Hagin plagiarized in his books. EW Kenyon was a Baptist preacher that attended many lectures in Boston in which New Age, New Thought and Eastern Religions were taught. Kenyon’s books and teachings are full of New Age catch words and these same dangerous concepts abound in Kenneth Hagin’s teachings.

If you are involved in the Word of Faith, then many of the teachings that you are being indoctrinated with are based on visions and New Age ideas. This is a dangerous mix of error and deception. People have died from this teaching.

I call the Word of Faith a cult because it’s members follow a man and his visions. The visions are full of extra revelation and unscriptural errors. Hardly a Word of Faith preacher can preach one sermon without quoting Kenneth Hagin.

I myself had my faith shipwrecked through this Movement. I have witnessed first hand the damage this false teaching has done in many, many lives. I receive numerous emails from others that have been almost destroyed by this teaching. It is incorrect. The Scriptures that the Movement uses to support it’s main doctrines have been twisted out of their context and settings.

Christian beware, theology does matter.

http://junkerjorge1.blogspot.com/2010/03/dangerous-hagin-cult.html

Phenerks Ex-Word of Faith testimony

Damon Whitsell — Thu, 07 Jan 2010 03:00:25 +0000

I was Wof in Tulsa for almost 13 years. I must admit during that time I probably grew in many areas of my spiritual life more than I had up to that point, but I also must admit that I was also becoming a bigger and bigger ‘flake’ in many areas, too. Each time I’ve given a portion of this testimony, the Wof will say that I was not really Wof during this period of my life. I can only say that with all the honesty I can muster that I was as sincere in my Wof beliefs as I knew to be. I studied under some of the “greats”; Billy Joe Daugherty, Ken Cope, Jerry Seville, Fred Price, Buddy Harrison, Ken Hagin, Capps, and a cast of many more. In fact, we were members of Beverly Hills Baptist in Dallas during the ‘hay days’ of Howard Conaster. I knew the Wof scriptures and I lived them. I realized, however that even though we were ‘believing’, confessing, giving, and serving in the Wof way, our lives were no more blessed or miraculous than some of our Baptist friends. Our group was getting sick, losing jobs, divorcing, and having trials just like the Baptists we knew. Then joy of joys…..my dear wife got pregnant with our second child after three miscarriages! We confessed and praised over the blessing ( we never said a word about the miscarriages – that would have been a bad confession and an admission that we were not living the victorious life we said we were ). Our baby was born big and healthy just like we and the Wof church we attended had confessed. Eighteen hours later, he was gone. There we were alone in the hospital wondering why. After my wife was able to come home we began the process of laying our boy to rest and went to our church and talked with the assoc pastor. During our talk we asked him the question on our hearts….why ? That’s when he went through a number of scriptures to show that we must have allowed satan in with either unbelief, sin, or bad confessions. Since I knew my heart better than him, I knew that I had done the best I could have and it “didn’t work” ! From that day we became more sensitive to the Wof insensitivity towards the pain and suffering around them.

I “stumbled” into a fine Baptist church right there in our neighborhood that we began to worship in. I was amazed at the topics that were emphasized that were never mentioned in the Wof circles we traveled in. Topics such as discipleship, and a daily quiet time. We still have several friends from that time that are Wof. One now suffers from a painful nerve condition that he says he’s healed of. Most of the others have divorced or they are Wof/Christians by association only. The biggest regret from my exposure to Wof was the smug I’m-more-spiritual-than-thou attitude I carried for many years after leaving Wof. I’m certain I hurt many dear people’s feelings during the time after leaving the Wof sect.

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Ex-Word of Faith Testimony by Cherie

Damon Whitsell — Thu, 17 Dec 2009 17:05:05 +0000

Cherie is the author of the Word of faith NO MORE blog.

I gave my life to the Lord in August of 1999. My best friend attended Word of Faith Christian Center in Michigan and led me in the prayer of repentance and into the WoF movement. I was living in California at the time and her Bishop had established churches all over the world. She led me to one of his churches on the west coast and that’s pretty much how it began. I also started to watch TBN and other networks in order to be “fed.” I wasn’t raised in the church and had no biblical foundation so everything that I learned in WoF I thought was the truth. I must admit that I sensed that something was wrong from the beginning. Never the less I continued to attend the faith church and basically thought everything that I experienced was normal.

2004- I attended the laypersons bible school that was established by the church. They took the curriculum from RHEMA and modeled the school after it. Our Bishop graduated from RHEMA and all of his children went there. He in turn established a Bible Training Center in Southfield Michigan which has educated thousands of pastors who are now pastoring his various churches. I considered attending RHEMA or BTC but I did not.

2006-God began to open my eyes to the falseness. Everything seemed wrong. The people were SO focused on the pastor and his family. An air of celebrity surrounded them that seemed totally idolatrous. I didn’t have any true biblical foundation so I didn’t know that the teachings were wrong, but knew that something was. I started to hear from demonic spirits. Familiar spirits were constantly tormenting me and trying to put their words in my mouth. I lived in a constant state of wondering if I was hearing from God, the devil or myself. It got so bad that I couldn’t sleep. Every time I closed my eyes I would have bombarding thoughts of suicide that were so bad I would cry all night and want to die. The scariest thing Victor is that I KNEW that I was hearing from familiar spirits. I was so confused and blamed it on what I thought was my call, and was on my way to becoming a false prophet. Since I believed that I was a prophet, I looked in the bible and found that many of the Old Testament prophets suffered from emotional issues. John the Baptist seemed quite out of his mind. Reading these things in the word confirmed that I wasn’t crazy I was just a prophet. I was very deceived.
2007-I met my husband at a Methodist ministry that we both worked for. He had never heard of Word of Faith because he is very orthodox and he didn’t watch TV at the time. Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Keith Butler, etc… were all new to him. He had no idea that this movement had penetrated the body of Christ because he was rooted and grounded in the truth.

2008-I married my husband and left WoF. God used him to bring me out of the Faith movement. He was very patient with me during the process of me being de-programmed. It was VERY difficult for me. I felt like I was betraying my family by leaving, even though I have not confronted my former pastor and they knew I was leaving to start a ministry with my husband. God used my husband to reveal all of the errors in WoF and he taught me the truth. We are now both working on our Masters in theology.

We still consider ourselves Pentecostal, however I think we can best be described as open but cautious. This is the short version of my WoF testimony.

In Christ,
Cherie

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Yodas Prodigy’s Ex-Word of Faith Testimony

Damon Whitsell — Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:03:21 +0000

Yodas Prodigy’s Ex-WoF Testimony from http://www.light-after-darkness.org/forums/entry.php?17-My-Testimony

I became a fully surrendered Christian to God in 1984. Before that time I had given my life to Christ but was not obedient due to various reasons. My home church was a Southern Baptist Church. None of my family was religious during my growing up years and neither were any of my friends.

Once I surrendered to Christ with the help of an Assemblies of God attendee, I followed my parents to Faith Center, a Word of Faith Church. My parents had gone there for a little while. I was about 25 at the time.

I had a message from God telling me that my wife would be Judy. The message came to me while I was away for training for eighteen weeks. It came in a dream. I knew when I got home that we would go out for a date. Around Christmas God told Judy that I was the one for her. We both had seen each other once before. But we had never spoken.

We dated starting January 1st twenty-two years ago. Then, we got engaged seven weeks later. And finally married on October 18th.
I seemingly fit in to Faith Center right away. I had a testimony of what God had done for me. He delivered me of some sin habits that I developed during my adolescent years. He helped me to understand who I am in Christ and completed the reconciliation that started in my life at about eighteen years of age.

I got involved in many ministries including: Children’s, Choir, Evangelism Explosion, and Deliverance. My eventual ministry, which I believe God wired me for, is apologetics. I started going to “Nationally known Kevin Johnson of Mount Carmel Outreach” apologetics class.

During the first few years of involvement at Faith Center and Mount Carmel Outreach, I had heard that there were people who left Faith Center and bad mouthed it. Well, the usual comment was that they had a bitter spirit or lacked faith. Being one of the “Spiritual” leaders of Faith Center, I bought in to those reasons.

While studying the scriptures, I found some problems with the Word Faith movement. It seemed that they left some important things out of their formulas. First God’s will isn’t necessarily our will. Our idea of good for us isn’t necessarily God’s idea of good for us.

Finally, God is sovereign not man. The rampant personalization and out-of-context use of scripture was more like incantations of people hoping to somehow hit the spiritual lottery.

The first great error that I encountered was the JDS (Jesus Died Spiritually) doctrine which sent up a huge flag. I found that many Word Faith Teachers/Preachers taught that Jesus did not pay for our sins on the cross. It was actually done in Hell. Then he had to be Born Again (BAJ).

The second problem I ran in to was that the teachers/preachers also taught that you are a little god. More flags went up.

I mentioned these items to someone who had called my home. Her husband went to the pastor and said that I was trying to be a schismatic and cause trouble. He also said that I was sending a petition around to get Word Faith books out of our store. At this point, I had not considered these things. I eventually asked the pastor to remove them. Of course, that did not happen. A side note, that man was later to be found addicted to cocaine during this time frame. He recently died a painful death.

There was much travail in my home and spiritual life. My wife and I left the church. We came back for a short time. But, that was it. A woman even told my wife that she had every right to leave me.

I began to study and learn all that I could on the Word Faith Movement. Most of the books were short with some good points. But they were not giving me the full value that I needed.

Some of those books were:

The Born-Again Jesus of the Faith Movement, Judith Matta
JDS: The Jesus Died Spiritually Heresy, Hobart Freeman
The Health and Wealth Gospel, Bruce Barron

I finally found a book by D.R. McConnell called, A Different Gospel. This book hit it all on the head. The historical roots of the Word Faith movement were the metaphysical mind science cults. And probably two years later, Christianity in Crisis was released. This was another solid book documenting what these guys were actually saying. One last book that I read recently was “The Word Faith Controversy” by Robert Bowman.

In a nutshell, if there were no “Little gods” doctrine or BAJ/JDS, I would have stayed at Faith Center much longer.

Recently, the last two plus years, I have gotten back in to apologetics. There was a two-fold reason. First, I had a Mormon come to my door and though I knew what to say, I was rusty. Second, my son attended an Assembly of God School which is loaded with Word Faith adherents.

Well, a year later, I got to defend the faith again with some visiting Mormons. And, my son had some questions about what some of his friends believed. I was able to clearly explain the Orthodox Christian perspective and show the error of the WoF system.

While spending time at a Christian Forum, I met Tallen who is solidly a Reformed- believer and is a strong proponent of the Confessions. He has had a profound impact on my understanding of Reformed Theology. I had a general understanding of the Confessions. I adhered to the London Confession mostly due to my SBC background. Since, I have taken time to research and write about, “The Three Forms of Unity”. And have begun to use the WCF as a resource when discussing doctrine with those of the cultic or heterodox persuasion.

I love systematic theology. I have A.A. and Charles Hodge, Berkhof, and Thiessen as resources. My library does include The Christian Institutes. I am a BIG R.C. SPROUL fan. I must have 7 or 8 of his books

I do have a sticking point in my theology. I am firmly covenantal in my eschatology. I lean towards Partial-Preterism. In some respects, I’m a tweener. I’m between many views not knowing which to hold to. So, in this area, have patience with me.

Shalom,

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Preparation Time

rickyd09 — Tue, 07 Jul 2009 13:49:37 +0000

During the past 14 years I had 11 surgeries, yes that is right 11 surgeries. Talk about being in the Lord’s Boot Camp I was there, but I feel that the 11 surgeries prepared me for what was to come in 2006 which was being diagnosed with stage 4 prostate cancer. It is truly amazing to look back at how I was able to make it through all those surgeries. I know that the only way I made it was through was with the Lord Jesus help. The Scripture verse from the Bible that kept me strong is:” I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me” Philippians Chapter 4 verse 13. It never started out as 11 surgeries, it started with one surgery and ended with eleven. Here is the list: 5 foot reconstruction surgeries, 3 knee replacements, 1 right shoulder joint replacement, 1 right hip replacement and 1 back surgery which was done in february of 2009.

This is the Lord’s boot camp there was no other way for me to face my health problems but straight on, my back was against the wall and there were no other options.The pain was too great, and the quality of life was diminishing. I knew from reading my Bible in the Book of Daniel where the the 3 Jewish boys Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego were thrown into the fiery furnace by King Nebuchadnezzar because they refused to bow down and worship the image of the king. The three Jewish boys knew that their God was able to deliver them even if they had to go into the furnace and God would deliver them and He did. For there was one walking with them in the furnace who looked lke the Son of God who was Jesus and they didn’t get burned (Daniel Chapter 3). In my case I knew the Lord Jesus would get me through this trial and everything was going to be all right , it took 14 years. But those 14 years were used for preparation time for the next physical problem to come which was stage 4 prostate cancer.

During those 14 years I became a physical therapy expert, rehabbing and reading my Bible daily brought me closer to God. I remember having a cast on my foot and thinking what it would be like to workout again. The waiting time helped me to appreciate the things that we always take for granted like walking, moving your shoulder with no pain or riding a stationary bike. The toughest part of rehab was going through it after knee replacement, in order to get full range of motion the knee must constantly be worked, bent and put through a whole assortment of movements which were killers, but I had to endure the torture in order to walk right again. All through it the Lord Jesus was helping me to endure and giving me patience to get through this physical thing that I was going through. It’s hard for people to imagine but as soon as one body part was repaired or replaced another part needed attention.

As of today I am back in the gym working out 4 to 5 days a week with stage 4 prostate cancer. And sharing my testimony to all who would listen of the love and mercy that Jesus has provided for everyone through His death on the Cross and His Resurrection that He would grant eternal life to all who repent and receive Him as Lord and Savior. Through all of this I know that God is Soverign that until I fulfill His plan for my life I am here until He calls me home.

http://rickyd2.wordpress.com/

Joel Osteen says Obama is a Christian: I am not the only one thinks Joel Osteen is a cowardl

Damon Whitsell — Sat, 27 Jun 2009 17:55:46 +0000

I’m not the only one who has doubts about what kind of truth Osteen believes. For those who think Joel Osteen and his beliefs are some how “ok,” article gotten here:

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=95041

What religion is Joel Osteen?
By Joseph Farah

Sometimes I get confused watching these mega-church preachers.

Are they reading the same Bible I’m reading?

Do they really have an intimate relationship with the same Jesus I know?

Is the Holy Spirit actually working within them – providing the kind of discernment He promises believers?

These questions came to mind while watching Joel Osteen and his lovely wife, Victoria, on CNN’s “Larry King Live” last week.

Is this the new face of American Christianity? Is this why Jesus died on the cross and was resurrected? Is this the Good News? Or is this some other religion altogether?

Admittedly, Osteen ticked me off right out of the gate by praising Barack Obama: “Well, I think he’s doing a great job. I’m impressed with his skill, his calmness, his just strength under pressure. These are tough times for him.”

Actually, no. These aren’t tough times for Obama. He’s having the time of his life. He’s partying it up and eating $100-a-pound beef in the White House. We should all face such tough times. Maybe that’s how the mega-wealthy Osteens define tough times. But I submit to you it is the American people who are suffering – not the Obamas.

But the interview actually went downhill from there.

King pointed out that many Americans are still confused about Obama’s religion and asked, “Does it matter?”

“Well, it matters to me,” said Osteen. “It matters to me that I know he loves the Lord, and I think it’s important that he has convictions from his faith. So to me, it matters when I’m making my personal decisions.”

Mrs. Osteen weighed in, too: “It does. It matters to me. … I believe he is a Christian.”

Now, let’s stop right there for a moment of reflection.

How do we know someone else is a believer? Is someone a Christian simply because they proclaim to be one? The Bible tells us we will know them by their fruits. I wonder what fruits the Osteens are seeing that would suggest to them Obama is a Christian?

In John 14:15, Jesus explains, “If you love Me, keep my commandments.”

Now, I won’t run through all of the Ten Commandments, but let’s stick to just one – the eighth: “Thou shall not steal.”

Not only is Obama stealing wealth from Americans today, he is stealing from our grandchildren – and our great-grandchildren!

But maybe that commandment is not in the Joel Osteen New Living Translation of the Bible the Osteens were hawking on the King show.

I don’t know about you, but I would like to see some real holy men in America stand up like the prophet Nathan and hold people – and especially our leaders – accountable to the Word of God.

Is that too much to ask?

America is going down the tubes fast, and the new faces of Christianity are playing patty-cake. They’re acting like the latest self-help gurus.

We need some wisdom, and we’re just not getting it from these lukewarm pretenders.

Now, look, I don’t care if Christian pastors want to keep their heads in the sand and protect their precious 501(c)3 corporations by avoiding politics altogether, as most of them do. But when they stand up on national television and proclaim Obama is a Christian and doing a good job, I have a real problem with that.

It’s a lie.

Obama is breaking his covenant with the American people every day. That covenant is the Constitution of the United States.

The Osteens cannot even stand up for the institution of marriage without equivocating.

True followers of Jesus win converts when they show people their sin and explain the consequences of sin. They don’t soft-pedal it. They’re not afraid of offending people. We can pretend to love everyone and watch them go right to hell. That is not the kind of love my messiah showed. And it is not the kind I expect to see from ministers of the Gospel.

RedeemedHippie>>>[Mr. Farah, may I say that the reason you do not see the true gospel among most of todays' ministers, is because most are not the truth at all; but star studded idols in a star struck idolizing church. These ministers are cowards to the truth.]

http://redeemedhippiesplace.wordpress.com/tag/apostacythe-great-falling-away/

Is Kim Clement being led by Lucifer and Hinduism?

Damon Whitsell — Sat, 27 Jun 2009 17:07:55 +0000

Kim Clement being led by Lucifer and Hinduism

I’m almost certain that my take on Kim Clement and his prophecy, will anger some people. Frankly, I don’t care. I would ask you, why are you not testing things by the Word of God? Why are you blindly following heretics and liars? Why do you make light of such prophecies when God tell us to test all things? Why oh why do you fear to even doubt these liars when God tells us in Deuteronomy to not fear them?

His prophecy can be found here, that is unless he takes it down. He is known to take his prophecies down when they don’t come true:

http://kimclementvault.com/prophecyread.asp?num=331

1/31/2009

The Spirit of the Lord says there’s something inside of you that was placed there from the foundation of the world that drives you to shout and rejoice in the presence of your enemies.

Redeemedhippie: [Jesus says, you must be born again. IF there had been something special in us from the day we were born, would not have Jesus told us? Instead, we are told to repent. Anything that drives us, is not the Holy Spirit leading us. We are to be led forth in peace. If anything makes you feel driven, TEST IT.]

God says raise up your voice and shout my name so that I can shake the kingdoms of hell!

RedeemedHippie: [God does not need our shouts for Him to do a thing. This sounds more like something Lucifer himself would want to do; shake the kingdoms of hell?! Why not the kingdom of heaven??? Why hell? Only if hell were about to be released upon the earth, that is why!]

God says the praises of my believers is raising from the dust those who have been aborted shall live.

RedeemedHippie: [WHAT?!]

They shall be reborn at another time, but those children who have been aborted will come back with a vengeance and shall raise up hell.

RedeemedHippie: [WHAT?!]

For the powers of darkness do not know what they did. The powers of darkness did not realize what they did when they crucified the Lord on High. They did not know what they did when they killed the little children after the age of 2, one escaped, Moses, and the vengeance upon him brought the wrath of God upon Egypt.

Redeemedhippie:[No. The vengence of God was upon Egypt because they held God's people as slaves and would not let them go.]

God said those that have been killed shall come back, they shall be born in another form, they shall come back in a vengeance, they shall take stock and they shall change the laws of this nation.

RedeemedHippie: [Liar! If anything comes back it will be legions of demons being released upon the earth. Change the laws of the nation? What? Dead aborted babies come back and change the laws of the nation?! What garbage! What lies! If you are a Kim Clement follower, this alone should be enough to make you run the other way. Kim Clement is a great liar and deceiver. He is endorsing nothing short of reincarnation and Hinduism.]

Do not be concerned for God says tonight I make declaration to you my resurrection is in this place and on this nation.

RedeemedHippie>[Do not be concerned has just turned Clement's listeners to mindless robots, if they weren't before then.]

I will forgive this nation’s sin. I will restore and then adore. There will be smiles once again.

RedeemedHippie: [The judgment of God is about to come upon the earth, dear saints of God. Do not be deceived nothing less is coming. Will God forgive this nation? Why should He? Our sins are many. There is no cry of repentence throughout the land. Wickedness abounds both in the world and within the church! I will restore and then adore. What garbage! There is only one worth adoring and that is Jesus Christ, Son of the most high God! There will be smiles once again--this is so juvenile. The apostate church has been in a laughing revival for how many decades now?]

But as I hear believers say we forgive them I’ll give you more your daily bread, I will restore unto this nation. Your Will be done your kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven.

RedeemedHippie: Huh?

There is a sound that I will send into this place called My house. God says, he’s telling you. I will restore, I will give you the honor that you once held America.

RedeemedHippie: [There is that word again the apostate church love using; sound. Who was in charge of sound in heaven before he was cast out? Lucifer. Where is the sound going? Straight to the church.

Honor? Honor to America? I doubt it very much. As the end-times approach us--and it most certainly does--the judgement of God will be released upon ALL nations and upon ALL governments. Man is a fool to believe that it is not coming. Look at ourselves, America! Our enemies laugh at us. The man who leads this nation is a joke to those who hate us. Not to say, God is angry with this nation! And rightly so. Evil is being called good and good is being called evil. God will judge.]

God says, I will restore, I’ll not ignore the ones who stood in contempt but I will repay I will give back to this nation what they have stolen. I will restore, I will restore I’ll give back to America your former glory greater than.

RedeemedHippie:[What hogwash. What tickling of ears! America is in such debt. The Word of God says, "I will make you the tail and not the head." THIS is where we are heading. NOTE --- When they say peace and safety, sudden destruction comes. Who are the ones in contempt? Those who doubt the false prophets like Clement? Hogwash! This too is manipulation to cause you not to test a thing this man says!]

God said I’m sending to earth a sound even greater than any sound that’s ever been on the face of the earth. I’m bringing a sound to this nation that every culture will understand the language of God.

RedeemedHippie: [One may have to ask, what god said that? May God in heaven help us if America is going to be the nation that will lead in the sound. This is delusion on a grand scale with America leading it.]

The Spirit of the Lord says those that heard the sound, when the sound was heard they were drawn.

RedeemedHippie: [Why oh why am I reminded of Daniel chapter 3?

"Then a herald cried aloud: “To you it is commanded, O peoples, nations, and languages, that at the time you hear the sound of the horn, flute, harp, lyre, and psaltery, in symphony with all kinds of music, you shall fall down and worship the gold image that King Nebuchadnezzar has set up; and whoever does not fall down and worship shall be cast immediately into the midst of a burning fiery furnace.” So at that time, when all the people heard the sound of the horn, flute, harp, and lyre, in symphony with all kinds of music, all the people, nations, and languages fell down and worshiped the gold image which King Nebuchadnezzar had set up.

This sound the aposte church keeps talking about--is it not Lucifer preparing to set himself up as god once again as in the days of Daniel?]

There is a sound that God has that men will begin to detect. There is a sound that shall be given and when you hear that sound advance speedily. When you hear that sound advance speedily, go quickly.

RedeemedHippie:[Yes, advance speedily, just as those in Daniels' day were expected to do. *please excuse my sarcasm there* But for pete sakes, TEST THIS!]

For God said in that day of Pentecost when the sound came suddenly, speedily there was an opening from the heaven and suddenly advancing upon them were tongues of fire that rested upon every one of them.

RedeemedHippie:[On the day of Pentacost, the believers were tarrying, waiting as commanded. They were not speeding around anywhere. IF an enemy can get you to react quickly without thinking, then that enemy has manipulated you and has power over you; such as in ANY cult. Jim Jones told his people, "quickly, quickly" in taking the kool-aid.

Bride of Christ, you are to test all things. You can not do this, if you are led to move quickly by the mere voice of man. You are to listen to God and God alone. NEVER let man take His place! If you have to wait for a week, month or year, whatever... you wait upon the Lord your God. Do not be moved by man! Jesus said, "My sheep hear MY voice." Listen for His voice. Stop and even test me!]

God said are you hungry for the tongues of fire? Are you hungry for the language of God? Are you hungry for the heavens to open and for God to send something that we’ve never experienced? I don’t think you believe this but you listen to this prophet tonight.

RedeemedHippie: [Such manipulation here. Listen to the prophet? What arrogance and pride! What if, at the time, one was using their brain and sensed something was not right, would they be doomed to hell for daring to question the prophet--Kim Clement? No, but they would have been accused of being rebellious, unteachable, Jezabelle, etc. Such are the ways of cults and manipulation.

Also, look at what god is trying to get the people to appeal to. Is there any mention of holiness? No. Is there any mention of repentence? No. Is there any mention of being more like Jesus? No. Is there any mention of Jesus at all? No. It is all about having experiences.]

There is a sound coming and it’s coming speedily. When the people begin to detect that sound they shall advance speedily, they shall accelerate speedily. This sound shall be as no other sound coming down from the high place, coming down from the high ground, coming down from the mountains, coming down from the sky, coming down from the treasury of heaven.

RedeemedHippie:[Keep in mind, Lucifer is this sound. If the people move speedily, when do they ever get to test the sound? Would God be angry if you wanted to be still and test the sound? Of course not. But Lucifer would. He would accuse you before those who are following the sound. Think about it.]

The heavens are opening up and God said tonight I’m promising you that once this sound hits this nation there shall be people who have said there is no God, shall suddenly proclaim, there is a God.

RedeemdHippie:[If Lucifer is the deceiver here--and he most certainly is-- then one would have to ask, what kind of god will people suddenly be proclaiming?]

There will be those that will be healed that would never have dreamed they’d be healed. There’ll be a spontaneous flow of unusual miracles and a spontaneous flow of new sounds and new language says the Spirit of God.

RedeemedHippie:[The word of God says the man if sin (anti-christ) comes with signs and wonders.]

Get ready for a baptism like you’ve never had before, for tonight as the prophets gather together we declare come down, rise up, do what you have to do.

RedeemedHippie:[Did you catch this? It is because the prophets have gathered together that one can get to experience all Clement has said. Such vain and self-exaltation! Just like Lucifer did before God cast him out of heaven!]

I have not forgotten the covenant. I have not forgotten the covenant. The antiquity of the covenant, the ancientness of the covenant that yet represents the dream that men had for this nation. That men equal in Spirit would stand as one and worship and honor the Lord. Where are they now? Their voices cry as a reminder they have come before me as a memorial says the Spirit of God.

Redeemedhippie:[To make man a memorial before God in any way, shape or form is blasphemous. Ther is only ONE worthy of all things. That is Jesus Christ. God honoring man? I don't think so. We are to honor God. Even now, the angels in heaven are worshipping Him. Kim Clement appeals to the flesh of man. He is a false prophet.]

You are entering a time and a season of hope and restoration coming not from the politicians of Baal but coming from the prophets of God so therefore a promise has been made.

Redeemedhippie:[Can you not see this?! It is the prophets of God that bring a season of hope and restoration?! I don't think so! Our hope is in God-- not in man! Our restoration is in and through God--not in man! Kim Clement desires to be honored among men. He is a liar and a fraud. We are to depend upon GOD for our hope and restoration.]

When you hear the sound that is coming to small villages and towns, amongst the farmers and the farmyards, barnyards, farm houses, ranches where there is space. I will show signs and they will say there is life on another planet but they will not find it they will not.

RedeemedHippie:[What a wacko.]

What they will find is that there is life in another universe where Spirits of just men made perfect. A great cloud of witness surrounds this earth. They will detect the great cloud of witness. What is this that you are saying? They will detect the energy of a witness which is to be repeated on the earth. They shall see signs and they shall be on large areas of acres and acres of land. I stand in Oklahoma today and make declaration to you that they shall say that these imprints and these signs in the soil come from life on another planet and again they will have movies and books; but this time they will not be able to explain the one thing that shall be embedded in these signs shall be the cross of Calvary, says the Spirit of the Living God. They shall try and make out like it is something else within the stars and the planets but they shall not be able to take away the crown that they see, the thorns that have been pressed.—This is a sign to you. You’re wondering what does this prophet say tonight?

RedeemedHippie:[Once again he calls himself a prophet. The only thing I wonder is how in the world does he get by with this?]

He says there will be signs in the earth and they will say it’s from another planet but God says it shall be signs that I shall send and in those places there will be a habitation of angelic visitation and a habitation of angels of the Lord and there shall be swift moves of the Spirit and they shall say let us go to the lonesome place where there are very few people. For God is shaking the earth in that place. God says celebrate, rejoice for tonight I begin this in this city, I begin it in this soil in this state and it shall spread like wildfire says the Spirit of God.

RedeemedHippie:[God says to celebrate? Never once repent? I guess God has changed the gospel? God hasn't but Kim Clement has though.]

God says there’s going to be a death in 2010. It shall be called the death of debt.

Redeemedhippie:[That one's a real doozy. I will not apologise for my indignation over this false prophet. Many many people are being led astray and sometimes there is no other way to say something, than just say it. If I seem a little emotional, I am. When man starts saying "god says, god says" when God has not said-- then they are creating God in their image. I hate lies and deception! Kim clement is one of the biggest out there. His words are manipulation and witchcraft!]

http://redeemedhippiesplace.wordpress.com/tag/witchcraft-in-the-church/

For They Preach Another Jesus

rickyd09 — Fri, 26 Jun 2009 02:35:41 +0000

It has become clearly apparent and evident after thorough examination that the men pictured here are preaching another Jesus. Kenneth Hagain, Kenneth Copeland and Creflo Dollar have over the years built empires by teaching heresy. Lets take a look at Dad Hagin, for the life of me I could never understand why people would call him dad . It must be a Rhema thing, even when I was attending a Word of Faith Church I never considered him as the father of faith. Jesus is always the object of our faith and not man. Over the years my opinion of Kenneth Hagin has changed from benign neutrality to an extremely dangerous one. Especially after watching a video clip from Pawcreek Ministries and Joseph Chambers titled Kenneth Hagin and the Spirit of the Serpent. The clip is from a 1999 Holy Ghost meeting where a Hagin starts hissing and moving his tongue around like a serpent and people begin to slither out of their chairs like snakes all while walking around like a man who was in a drunken stupor.

Then the laughing what was that all about, I believe that he was so apostate that the laughing revivals were actually blaspheming the Holy Spirit which is the unpardonable sin.

The point that I am trying to make is this that side show was apex of Hagin’s blasphemy and God’s Judgement has been on Rhema ever since. Kenneth Hagin’s ministry from the beginning was founded on plagerism, false visions of Jesus, paranormal experiences, twisting the scriptures and lies. The Jesus he preached was one who going to make you healthy and wealthly, which was bad enough, but he taught that Jesus took on the nature of Satan on the Cross and died spiritually. This is a complete heresey and a baldface lie which Hagain plagurized from EW Kenyon along with many others. Justin Peters in his seminar Call for Discernment goes into the origin of the Word of Faith cult and it is a cult which dabbles in the occult under the teaching of Divine Revelation.

Both Kenneth Copeland and Crefalo Dollar take Word of Faith false teaching and heresy to another level. Some call it hyper faith I call it just same old lie that Satan told Adam and Eve in the Garden that they could be as gods. It is Kenneth Copeland who said the biggest failure in the Bible was God. In one of his infamous prophecies Copeland was told supposedly by Jesus that I did not claim I was God; I just claimed I walked with Him and that He was in Me.(Kenneth Copeland, Take time to pray,Believers Voice of Victory 15,2 ( Feb. 87). With his little gods teaching Crefalo Dollar has moved up the ladder in the Word of Faith anals. The teaching about being little gods is not new for Benny Hinn pushed forth this heresy years ago. Dollars spin on this teaching is amazingly sad and very blasphemous , it goes like this if horses got together they produced what? another horse. If dogs got together, they produced what? another dog. If the Godhead got together, what did they produce? and the congregation said: the Godhead produced god, therefore ye are little gods. No, no, absolutely not; God created man, in His image and likeness not to be litte gods, but to be man His highest creation subject to the Creator. God is the object of our worship, not man.

As the Apostle Paul states so clearly in II Corinthians chapter 11 vs 3 & 4 ” But I fear lest by any means as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he who comes Preaching another Jesus whom we have not Preached or if you receive another spirit, which you have not received or another gospel which you have not accepted, you might well bear with him”. The Gospel of Christ is simple, but men twist the scripture for their benefit. Paul preached Jesus Christ and Him Crucified anything else is another Jesus.

http://rickydslife1waytoheaventhroughjesus1.wordpress.com/

Are all healed? Is there Absolute Healing in the Atonement?

Damon Whitsell — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 05:24:19 +0000

Absolute Healing in the Atonement

I believe there is no truth to be found in teaching that healing is for everyone. Much of this is based on false teaching as we find the word of God once again has been taken out of context. Many are not healed and we do not have a reason why that happens. Instead of accepting that some of us will be sick because we live in a fallen world, we tell others healing is part of the salvation process. It is not. Our salvation is free upon asking. If healing was meant to be in the atonement, it would happen the same way. And, yes, the Greek word used in the New Testament for saved and healed is sozo. However, the word never says all will be healed, just as all will not be saved.

Please note, that many of the disciples were sick and a quick read through the New Testament will prove that. Paul was not healed and here are his thoughts:

2 Corinthians 12:8-10

⁸ Concerning this thing I pleaded with the Lord three times that it might depart from me. ⁹ And He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. ¹⁰ Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in needs, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ’s sake. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

So many times I have heard people say that Paul was not sick. Why, when the scripture above clearly states he was and remained so?

Jesus came to earth as a man. He was weak, ordinary and vulnerable. He suffered as a man so that he could identify with us in every area of our humanness.

Philippians 2:7 but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men.

Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin.

When we tell others salvation is in the atonement and they have a “right” to their healing, and tell them that there is a reason they are not being healed, we send them on an internal rampage to find out why that is – did they not pray right, with the right words, did they not rebuke the devil enough, often enough, in the right manner, did the person praying for them not speak the right words or have enough faith, was their own attitude or heart not in the right place, is there unforgiveness, bitterness, anger or jealousy, is there a lack of faith…on and on it goes. It is all based on what they do, or in this case, what they speak. We are teaching people to work for their healing, to pray specifically, to “receive their healing” or to pray to “keep their healing”. We are not taught any of this in the word. How closely this resembles another false teaching involving a false prophet that make people work for salvation!

When Jesus brought healing He did so simply; He did not go through a long list of reasons for repentance, He did not run through their generational line to find the curse. To teach otherwise is unscriptural How many people can you think of that are in a healing ministry of some sort, or who believe healing is in the atonement have died of an illness or disease? How many likewise have been hospitalized for injuries or are sick and have been for many years?

This entire Word of Faith/Prosperity teaching causes people to believe in a god that does not exist. When the promise of the “blessing” or “healing” or “prosperity” does not come as promised they become mad at God or wonder why God does not do for them what has been claimed. We are not promised a good life here. We are told of much tribulation and if there is any doubt, we can read about the experiences of the disciples.

John 16:33 These things I have spoken to you that in Me you will have peace. In the world you will have tribulation, but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world.

Remember, Job was a Godly man who suffered tremendously. All of the counsel of his friends proved to be wrong by God’s own words!

Job 38:1-2¹Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said: ² “Who is this who darkens counsel by words without knowledge?”

God is to be given the glory in all situations, not just in healthy ones. And yes, God still heals people today! He alone knows the beginning to the end, and the “why’s” of all things. I don’t know why people continue to teach such things. Maybe its money, maybe fame. Whatever the reason it is false, false, false – words without knowledge.

http://mkayla.wordpress.com/2009/06/08/areallhealed/